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Author Topic: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)  (Read 1080 times)

foxguard9

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Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« on: February 18, 2021, 04:55:46 pm »
Ogre Battle (SNES) is still one of my most favorite games. There's not many games quite like it!  :)
 
I've played a large number of mods for the game as well as used the wonderful OB-Edit tool and performed save state hacking, so I have a very novice understanding of hacking. I have modded for PC games before but alas have never created a hack on my own without the help of ready-made tools.

One of the more complex hacks that Zombero did was make it so Doll Mages would use Acid x1 and Healing x1 while positioned in the back row. This is unusual because no other player-controlled class can use two different skills in the same position. It's always just the one skill performed X number of times.

The exception to this is what the Magic command does for the Wizard family. On the player's screen, it just says "Magic" as the skill. In actuality, it's some type of AI routine which the game classifies as a single skill. During battle, the Magic command automatically uses the spell (the element) that the target is most weakest too. So while it says "Magic" on the player menu, the character will actually use one of its available choices: "Fireball", "Lightning Bolt", "Darkness", etc. on an enemy each round.

With the OB-Edit tool, you can change which skills each character performs, and of the skill options available you can also choose routines which are used for bosses. These routines are either conditional like the "Magic" example or in a specific order like the "Doll Mage" example above.

Unfortunately, it doesn't look like OB-Edit is sophisticated enough to actually create the routines. I find the routine aspect very appealing and would like to create a hack where I can implement that type of customization. So the end result I'm looking for is to (1) create or edit which skills are assigned to a specific routine and (2) use OB-Edit to assign that routine (skill) to a particular class.

Could someone point me in the right direction? I'd like to understand:

a. Are there any other pre-built tools / utilities I may not be aware of that could accomplish this easily / somewhat easily?
b. If not, per the beginner's guide would I start with rom corruption and work from there?
« Last Edit: February 18, 2021, 05:47:38 pm by foxguard9 »

FAST6191

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2021, 09:30:48 am »
a. No idea but doubtful -- normally a hacker that expands it then gets to make a fork/their own tool to handle such things, or it becomes so beloved by the community that they expand support for it. If you are already versed in such things/have done the token search then yeah.


b. Corruption is useful enough for finding graphics, level data and maybe audio within the ROM itself (corrupt it, if your sprites are messed up you know what you tweaked dealt with sprites...), or fiddling with RAM and seeing what changes there. For this sort of thing... less useful and I would go for a more targetted approach. If you have an example of something like what you would want then you can even start with that -- compare the Zombero hack you speak of with the stock ROM, whatever is changed will speak to what you changed (hopefully it is fairly single purpose and not part of a larger major hack).
If you have to start from scratch then find something that the skill changes (consumables, MP, HP... whatever) and work backwards from there to find things. This will necessarily be assembly hacking which tends to be one of the later things most learn, though as you will mostly be working within existing parameters rather than going completely into new territory then you might get something.


DragonAtma

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2021, 11:11:26 am »
I normally edit games by hand, not with tools; the list of multiple acti0ons starts at 19230 (or 19030 if you don't have a header). Finnshore's rom map lists it in more detail: https://finnshore.webs.com/rom-map.txt

Some more info is at https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/588541-ogre-battle-the-march-of-the-black-queen/71686915

And I stand by my statement that any OB modder should read the Big Three Threads:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/588541-ogre-battle-the-march-of-the-black-queen/40090402
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/588541-ogre-battle-the-march-of-the-black-queen/43853002
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/588541-ogre-battle-the-march-of-the-black-queen/54266112
In memory of my beloved cats, Anastasia (9/30/06-9/18/17, illness) and Josephine (1/19/06-9/23/17, cancer).
My mods: Romance of the Three Kingdoms II, Gemfire, 7th Saga, and more

foxguard9

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2021, 12:02:31 am »
Thank you! That was super helpful. I'll run with what you all said. You folks are awesome!!  :thumbsup:

MysticLord

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2021, 04:10:54 pm »
@DragonAtma did you ever figure out how to change the 3 skills used in each ninjitsu select-a-spell, or the Wizard/Mage select-a-spell skills? I want Ninjas to use only strength based skills.

On a related note, how do I change the name of the skill used so the modified ninjitsu would display the original names when used? I assume I need to edit text pointers in a pointer table somewhere.

Maybe animation pointers too.

BTW, I'm done with the ally/enemy/neutral spreadsheet editor, just need to test the python scripts that go with it and write the readmes.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2021, 04:31:08 pm by MysticLord »

DragonAtma

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2021, 06:06:57 pm »
Nope; people found where some of the multi-spell sets are (Cerberus, Rashidi, all three Diablo, Endora, Dandy, and both Geminis) but I don't think they ever found where wizard and ninja spellsets are hidden.
In memory of my beloved cats, Anastasia (9/30/06-9/18/17, illness) and Josephine (1/19/06-9/23/17, cancer).
My mods: Romance of the Three Kingdoms II, Gemfire, 7th Saga, and more

MysticLord

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2021, 09:18:22 pm »
I made a spreadsheet and python scripts to ease editing of neutral encounters, allied recruits, and enemy encounters. It's pending submission here at RHDN, but until then you can find it on the discord server I just made, or in the temporary download below.

https://discord.gg/YRWaZsQ89p

Here's a temporary upload, should last for 30 days, for those of you who don't want to wait but also don't want to use discord.

https://ufile.io/uma307pw

the_E_y_Es

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Re: Looking for guidance where to start: Ogre Battle (SNES)
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2021, 07:02:17 pm »
ninja spellsets are hidden.
Well naturally! /jk

Zombero seems to have retired from modding and walked into the proverbial sunset. It's too bad, I'd like to see more of his contributions.