Final Fantasy NES Trilogy Translations

[Thirteen 1355]

I'm considering to make some updates to various stats for the NES Final Fantasy games (actually, already working on some).
I want to change some imbalanced attributes (starting with FF2's shop prices) to reflect their GBA/PSP stats.

I'd like to hear some suggestions on which stats would be better adjusted to remake ones, since I've never played the originals myself. Chaos Rush' translation patches made me want to try them anyway, but then I came with the idea to maybe update the originals a bit.
December 28, 2019, 08:50:11 AM - (Auto Merged - Double Posts are not allowed before 7 days.)
Seems there's not that much to update regarding FF2. I updated guest characters' initial stats to remake standards (and defaults MP from 5 to 10), shop prices, final boss HP from 10000 to 15000.

I expected there to be bigger differences, especially in monster stats, but I guess that's regarding FF1 instead.

[Chaos Rush]

Hi everyone, even though I am no longer working on these, I still lurk on RHDN and thought I'd mention something regarding an update another user wanted to do.

User redmagejoe is working on fixing all of FF2's bugs in the vanilla game, and with my permission, has also made a v1.8 for the FF2 translation that fixes some typos.

Also in order to clear up some miscommunication, I am no longer working on these, but I have no issue with people that want to update these further - you do not need my permission. My intent was to pass these projects on to the community.

So to be clear, any further updates are not done by me, and also anyone is free to update them. Should you do so, I hope that people understand that these patches are meant to follow the terminology used by whatever is the most recent official version of FF1-3 by Square Enix, and I know that some people may disagree with the official terminology for valid reasons, but for the sake of consistency I hope people consider what my original intent was for these translations - pretend as if this is something Square Enix wouldn't mind putting out and live up to those standards. If you want to use these as a base for a new project with a different goal, then go ahead, but make it clear that it's a separate project rather than a continuation/update of these translations.

I won't be active much on RHDN but I might occasionally post to give my two cents on something.

Should anyone want to further update these, it might be worth considering starting a new thread in order to not confuse people since I am no longer working on these.

[Neon Streetlight]

Hi everyone, even though I am no longer working on these, I still lurk on RHDN and thought I'd mention something regarding an update another user wanted to do.

User redmagejoe is working on fixing all of FF2's bugs in the vanilla game, and with my permission, has also made a v1.8 for the FF2 translation that fixes some typos.

Also in order to clear up some miscommunication, I am no longer working on these, but I have no issue with people that want to update these further - you do not need my permission. My intent was to pass these projects on to the community.

So to be clear, any further updates are not done by me, and also anyone is free to update them. Should you do so, I hope that people understand that these patches are meant to follow the terminology used by whatever is the most recent official version of FF1-3 by Square Enix, and I know that some people may disagree with the official terminology for valid reasons, but for the sake of consistency I hope people consider what my original intent was for these translations - pretend as if this is something Square Enix wouldn't mind putting out and live up to those standards. If you want to use these as a base for a new project with a different goal, then go ahead, but make it clear that it's a separate project rather than a continuation/update of these translations.

I won't be active much on RHDN but I might occasionally post to give my two cents on something.

Should anyone want to further update these, it might be worth considering starting a new thread in order to not confuse people since I am no longer working on these.

Thanks for the update, Chaos! Glad to know you're still present here. Hope all is well.

[Heaven Piercing Man]

If you want to use these as a base for a new project with a different goal, then go ahead, but make it clear that it's a separate project rather than a continuation/update of these translations.

This so much. In software development, this is called Forking, and it's perfectly fine to do so, especially when dealing with open source/community based projects. In fact, many software forks are "downstream" meaning they're not fully divorced, but update in tandem with the original project to keep any fixes alongside the new focus of the fork.

[KIL913]

Thank you for pointing that out. Can you confirm that you're playing v1.2? I have a theory on what's causing it (it's probably reading from a DTE char even though I thought I disabled it for battles) but first I want to make sure you have v1.1 or v1.2 because in those versions I fixed the repeated character bug that people were talking about in earlier pages.

Has this ever been fixed? I know this is almost a dead thread but I'm just wondering if there is still anyone who are polishing FFI and FFIII's text bugs or issues? P.S. Chaos you don't have to reply to my reply as I know you are currently working on your game still, kudos and thanks for all your hard work. I'm just wondering. Thanks!

[Thirteen 1355]

I felt this is the only place where people understand this game's story enough to give a solid answer.

I played a bit of this game on PC but I hate the look, so I switched to the NES version with Chaos Rush' translation. Great work, the best way to play this in my opinion!

My issue is that the more I play, the less I understand the plot. The FFwiki seems to be stating false information as well. It's clear by now that the Flood of Light took place 1000 years before the start of the game. However, the wiki states that Xande's sinking of the surface world/stopping time happened 1000 years before the start as well. The NES version doesn't seem to state the fact that this second event took place so long ago. I feel Xande's stopping of time only happened shortly before the start of the game.

Another thing the wiki says is that Xande was responsible for rising the Floating Continent into the air. However, the game seems to state it's the Ancients that did this, before the Flood of Light happened.

In the end, I can't seem to piece together when Xande decided to unleash earthquakes and sink the surface/freeze time at all. It doesn't seem sensible if that would happen around the same time as the Flood of Light that destroyed the civilization of the Ancients. The Floating Continent also was already around when Xande did all this.

Anyone who can explain this all to me?

[Chaos Rush]

Hi everyone, I still log in occasionally. I'm still working on my indie game, thought I'd answer a few questions.

Has this ever been fixed? I know this is almost a dead thread but I'm just wondering if there is still anyone who are polishing FFI and FFIII's text bugs or issues? P.S. Chaos you don't have to reply to my reply as I know you are currently working on your game still, kudos and thanks for all your hard work. I'm just wondering. Thanks!

Redmagejoe has taken over FF2 and has a separate thread for it. To my knowledge FF1 and FF3 haven't been updated since I last did in October. As for that bug, I believe it was the same bug as another issue that someone brought up where certain battle messages wouldn't display correctly, which was fixed. I am not sure if it is connected to the same issue that you are describing but if that issue is in the current version then I apologize.

I felt this is the only place where people understand this game's story enough to give a solid answer.

I played a bit of this game on PC but I hate the look, so I switched to the NES version with Chaos Rush' translation. Great work, the best way to play this in my opinion!

My issue is that the more I play, the less I understand the plot. The FFwiki seems to be stating false information as well. It's clear by now that the Flood of Light took place 1000 years before the start of the game. However, the wiki states that Xande's sinking of the surface world/stopping time happened 1000 years before the start as well. The NES version doesn't seem to state the fact that this second event took place so long ago. I feel Xande's stopping of time only happened shortly before the start of the game.

Another thing the wiki says is that Xande was responsible for rising the Floating Continent into the air. However, the game seems to state it's the Ancients that did this, before the Flood of Light happened.

In the end, I can't seem to piece together when Xande decided to unleash earthquakes and sink the surface/freeze time at all. It doesn't seem sensible if that would happen around the same time as the Flood of Light that destroyed the civilization of the Ancients. The Floating Continent also was already around when Xande did all this.

Anyone who can explain this all to me?

So I've recently played through the original Japanese version of Final Fantasy III and so it's still kinda fresh in my head, although some details might be hazy. I'll do my best to explain the plot. First of all, some of the confusion is because the DS version changed some plot elements which caused a lot of contradictions. Also, some of this information is explained in optional dialogue that the player might skip, such as the texts in the Saronia Library.

Here is the plot of the original FF3:

In the world of FF3, there has been an eternal struggle between light and dark. During the time of the Ancients, some people tried to abuse the power of light, creating an imbalance so that Light far outweighed Darkness, so four warriors - the Warriors of Darkness - were granted the power of the Dark Crystals and defeated the light. After the incident, what was left of the civilization became the floating continent. The Gulgans predicted that this would happen again, and they were correct.

Thousand(s) of years ago there was the Great Magus Noah who had three apprentices: Doga, Unei, and Xande. When Noah was getting old and ready to pass away, he gave each of his apprentices a special gift. Doga received magic, the mastery of and knowledge of it. Unei received the dream world and became the guardian of it. Xande received what was said to be the greatest gift of all: mortality. However, Xande didn't like that, and was pissed that he became a mortal. In order to ensure his immortality, Xande drained the power of two of the crystals, which flooded the land and froze time on the surface world (Xande can't die as long as time is frozen).

Now things kind of get hazy from here, basically because time is frozen on the surface world, but not on the floating continent. But anyhow, the Cloud of Darkness gathers all this power over this 1000 years, and another imbalance has occurred. Remember how the Gulgans predicted it? Well anyhows the imbalance is happening again, only this time it's Darkness overpowering Light instead of the other way around. So the gods(?) or the Crystals(?) or Aria herself(?)* finally choose the current iteration of the Warriors of Light, and thus an earthquake occurs on the floating continent which causes a chain of events that leads to four orphans from the town of Ur to becoming christened as the Warriors of Light. This whole time Xande is chilling at the Crystal Tower on the surface world where time is frozen, so he hasn't aged a day since the two crystals on the surface world were drained.

*So regarding Aria the shrine maiden of the Water Temple, she somehow managed to survive the flood and didn't get sunken in and frozen in time with everyone else on the surface (along with a random old man). She, the old man, and Xande are all still alive after 1000 years because time is frozen even though they themselves can apparently move around and do stuff. With that said, Aria is sort of the "guardian" of the Water Crystal, and while I don't remember specifically, she either prayed or "hoped" that the Warriors of Light would appear and save the world. So it's possible that her hope is also what enabled/motivated the Light Crystals to finally choose/find the candidates for who will become the Warriors of Light.

So basically, everything Xande did was 1000 years ago, but time has been frozen on the surface world as well, hence why to Xande and Aria it feels like a recent event.

[Thirteen 1355]

Thanks a lot for the summary! So, the order of events is basically:

- thousands of years ago: Ancients, Floating Continent created, Flood of Light destroys the Ancients on the surface, they move to the Floating Continent
- (One) thousand years ago: Xande receives his gift, gets mad and uses the Earth Crystal to get his immortality back (by sinking stuff, causing earthquake on
  surface and all that)
- Recent/currently: Four Warriors of Light 'awaken,' events of FF3

Are Noah and his apprentices Ancients themselves too?

[Chaos Rush]

Thanks a lot for the summary! So, the order of events is basically:

- thousands of years ago: Ancients, Floating Continent created, Flood of Light destroys the Ancients on the surface, they move to the Floating Continent
- (One) thousand years ago: Xande receives his gift, gets mad and uses the Earth Crystal to get his immortality back (by sinking stuff, causing earthquake on
  surface and all that)
- Recent/currently: Four Warriors of Light 'awaken,' events of FF3

Are Noah and his apprentices Ancients themselves too?

Hmm, I just did some looking up, and although the English FF wiki claims that Xande created the continent (which iirc might have been a concept introduced in the DS version?) the texts in the library of Saronia contradict that, as according to that in-game text the floating continent was kind of like a 'project' that Desch's father worked on (Desch himself is an Ancient).

With that said I think that is the correct order of events, basically the Flood of Light was something long, long before Xande's time, and back then the Warriors of Darkness had their own adventure to defeat some evil Ancient. So with that said, Noah, Doga, Unei, and Xande are not Ancients (though that's something that might have gotten altered/fudged up in the DS version) as their backstory is the beginning of the Flood of Darkness.

So basically (the original Famicom version at least):

Eons ago (like, 9999999 years ago): Flood of Light: unnamed Ancient bad guy(s) tries to take over the Light, the Four Warriors of Darkness 'awaken'

Time shenanigans starting 1000 years ago to present: Flood of Darkness: Xande tries to take over the Darkness, the Four Warriors of Light 'awaken'

EDIT: One of the Dark Warriors mentions that the Flood of Light was 1000 years ago. So, I guess Xande getting angry and doing bad stuff is something that happens right after the Flood of Light.

So this should be it:

1000 years ago: Warriors of Darkness defeat Ancient bad guy who caused the Flood of Light. The Floating Continent gets created, the remaining Ancients take refuge there. Maybe a few years later or something there's enough survivors on the surface world to create kingdoms like Saronia and such. Around this time Xande gets mad at Noah and floods the world and freezes time so he could live forever.

Present: Four Onion Knights go on an adventure

[Thirteen 1355]

That's really interesting. This site states something else, but I already kinda suspected it wasn't 'right,' since according to it, Xande did nothing for thousand years after being given mortality.
http://chrysaliswiki.com/encyclopedia:timeline-of-the-world-in-ffiii

It's super interesting how vague the story of FF3 is. Most of the older RPGs had very simplistic stories.

[Chaos Rush]

That's really interesting. This site states something else, but I already kinda suspected it wasn't 'right,' since according to it, Xande did nothing for thousand years after being given mortality.
http://chrysaliswiki.com/encyclopedia:timeline-of-the-world-in-ffiii

It's super interesting how vague the story of FF3 is. Most of the older RPGs had very simplistic stories.

I had to think about this for a little while, but I think I've sorted it out.

So basically, we know that Noah and his three apprentices were from a long time ago. When Unei awakens, she says that she was in the Dream World for eons. Thus this firmly places Xande as also existing a long time ago as well.

But since he was given mortality, the only way he can still be alive in the present is if time is frozen, since he's just a regular human (unless if the Cloud of Darkness gave him uhh "darkness powers" or something to stay alive). So let's say he did freeze the surface world hundreds/thousand years ago.

But then who caused the earthquake, which was a recent event? My interpretation is this: Xande doing stuff long ago indirectly caused the earthquake to happen in the far future on the Floating Continent

I think maybe, the Flood of Light was 1000 years ago, then the surface world was given a couple centuries to develop a new civilization (Saronia, etc.), and then Xande froze everything.

[Thirteen 1355]

Aah yes, that makes the most sense. Thanks a lot for taking the time to solve this mess.

[KIL913]

Hi everyone, I still log in occasionally. I'm still working on my indie game, thought I'd answer a few questions.

Redmagejoe has taken over FF2 and has a separate thread for it. To my knowledge FF1 and FF3 haven't been updated since I last did in October. As for that bug, I believe it was the same bug as another issue that someone brought up where certain battle messages wouldn't display correctly, which was fixed. I am not sure if it is connected to the same issue that you are describing but if that issue is in the current version then I apologize.

Is there anyway I can fix this myself?

[Chaos Rush]

Aah yes, that makes the most sense. Thanks a lot for taking the time to solve this mess.

I think what threw me off was the whole '1000 years' phrase. From what it looks like, nothing mentions specifically how long ago Xande flooded the surface world and froze time, but the Flood of Light was definitely 1000 years ago and is a separate, unrelated event to Xande flooding/freezing the surface world. Some wikis/pages claiming that the flood was a recent thing is a mistake because it's impossible for Xande to even be alive if that was the case, and his whole motivation for his actions was to freeze time so he won't die of old age.

I think it's safe to say that Xande, Unei, Doga, and Noah are definitely not Ancients, they're just powerful wizards from the "Saronia era" timeline. Doga even has a mansion on the surface world lol, and he's just chilling there until the Warriors of Light from the Floating Continent arrive.

[AsheManosse]

I realize that this whole thread took on more of the topic of FF1 English Translation, but I wanted to thank Chaos Rush (and anyone else who helped) for coming back to this project and reworking the FFIII English Translation to be compatible with real hardware (original MMC3 mapping, versus alternative MMC5 mapper used for the 1st pass). 

I was one of the folks who brought this issue up back in 2017, and I'm unbelievably excited to get the new version of FFIII onto a cartridge and play it on my NES!  (As soon as I figure out how to do all of that again and buy the right parts... lol.)

[lavignep]

Try the kazoo at www.infiniteneslives.com easy to use and pretty cheap. I have used it in the past and it works great. I heard the new version doesn't have a GUI anymore but you'll figure it out. I have switched to I Voultar 8bitters. A little more involved but closer to my tastes.

[JAJT]

Regarding your FF2 translation - I noticed a few oddities right out of the gate, not sure if they were known:

1. In the Paloom armor shop, you have the Copper Cuirass named as a Bronze item:



2. I don't know if this was intentional, but was there a reason why the icons got changed in shops? Especially the color additions? I can't seem to figure out why some items have odd splashes of colors added (like magic tombs and the gloves in the photo above) and why some don't.

[Vanya]

Could be the shop keepers sprite layered under the dialogue box since the black pixels are treated as "empty".