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Author Topic: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210610  (Read 527036 times)

mkwong98

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210418
« Reply #2060 on: April 19, 2021, 05:55:07 am »
How about the player charges up by landing hits like SD3 but loses part of the gauge when getting hurt?

Pesukarhu7

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210418
« Reply #2061 on: April 19, 2021, 06:50:34 am »
I couldnt get mono to run the exe natively on mac but using linux vm worked and thanks a lot hopefully it wasnt too much work to get it working on mono even though only a few people such as myself will even use it excited to try it out finally :woot!:
« Last Edit: April 19, 2021, 06:55:47 am by Pesukarhu7 »

Mr X

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210418
« Reply #2062 on: April 19, 2021, 03:16:38 pm »
After beating Mech Rider 2, after the dialogue Flammie is supposed to appear, but after talking to the King the dialogue just closes, you can talk to him again and the dialogue box kind of glitches a bit.

Queue

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2063 on: April 19, 2021, 03:57:20 pm »
Version 2021-04-19:
https://filebin.net/7spaiz2xfys6b2i1/SoM_Turbo.210419.zip
Alternate Link:
https://www.sendspace.com/file/lcq32r

Changes:
- fixed game breaking bug in Text\Reborn\Proportional_Font
- fixed incorrect character width measurement for \print_item= and \print_magic=
- fixed recently introduced bug in Reborn dragon naming event (if you chose "I like it")



mkwong98, I've considered that, but I'm not sure what a good control scheme would be to actually execute the charged attack, if basic attacks were charging it up. If once charged, the next attack does a charged attack, you'd come to resent having less control over when and whether you get to. Using the run button is unacceptable. X might be the most available, but that's unpleasant (combat is B and X? bleh).

Pesukarhu7, dang about Mac + Mono, but excellent that you went further and got it to work via a Linux VM. It actually took a lot of time and effort of two people to resolve lots of little issues to have the patcher work acceptably on Mono (I think we spent 3 or 4 weeks on it?); we got some good feature additions out of the effort, fixed some bugs and improved patching time, though if even one person gets use out of the Mono compatibility (and it seems you did) then I consider the time spent worth it.

Mr X, dammit, looks like [I]|Flammie_Drum to insert the item name isn't working correctly and breaking the event. Thanks for the report and sorry for all the bugs this update. -_-



Edit: Added new version to beginning of post. It solves the problem you ran into Mr X (hopefully without causing others, arg).
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 03:02:10 am by Queue »

hmsong

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2064 on: April 19, 2021, 10:34:03 pm »
Sigh.  What's with sendspace?  I can't download.  The download button just reloads the page.

Queue

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2065 on: April 20, 2021, 12:25:12 am »
I re-uploaded and updated the first and previous post with new URLs. Not sure what the issue was, but it (and filebin) have been having problems today it seems.

Mr X

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2066 on: April 20, 2021, 05:40:07 pm »
Wanted to make sure, I wonder if the chest orb in the Grand Temple has been removed, instead getting the Sword orb in the Emperor's Castle.

Queue

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2067 on: April 20, 2021, 06:20:36 pm »
With Items\Weapons_Progression_Balance but without Level_8_Instead:
- the sword orb chest added to the Imperial Castle throne room will give you sword orb 5
- then when you beat Tasnica, that'll give you 6th
- then the Grand Palace should give you 7th
- without Remove_Empire_Castle_Gate, a Dark Palace chest should give you the 5th

With Level_8_Instead, the Grand Palace chest only takes you to 6, which you should already have from Tasnica, so the chest won't spawn because you already have the sixth orb (then you get the 7th from a tree, and the 8th from Farmable_Sword_Orb).

If you skip the new Imperial Castle orb, Tasnica will only give you the 5th, the Imperial Castle chest will then be gone, and you'll get the 6th in the Grand Palace.

So with Level_8_Instead and Remove_Empire_Castle_Gate, the new Imperial Castle orb is an alternative that lets you have the sword one level higher earlier, with the Grand Palace orb as a safety if you didn't go get the Imperial Castle orb; the tree orb would also function as a safety, since it specifically sets you to 7th, but whatever, more safeties isn't really a bad thing.

I think that's all accurate. It's kind've convoluted to sort out the patch conflicts and what the end result is.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 06:32:57 pm by Queue »

Mr X

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2068 on: April 21, 2021, 01:35:27 am »
With Items\Weapons_Progression_Balance but without Level_8_Instead:
- the sword orb chest added to the Imperial Castle throne room will give you sword orb 5
- then when you beat Tasnica, that'll give you 6th
- then the Grand Palace should give you 7th
- without Remove_Empire_Castle_Gate, a Dark Palace chest should give you the 5th

With Level_8_Instead, the Grand Palace chest only takes you to 6, which you should already have from Tasnica, so the chest won't spawn because you already have the sixth orb (then you get the 7th from a tree, and the 8th from Farmable_Sword_Orb).

If you skip the new Imperial Castle orb, Tasnica will only give you the 5th, the Imperial Castle chest will then be gone, and you'll get the 6th in the Grand Palace.

So with Level_8_Instead and Remove_Empire_Castle_Gate, the new Imperial Castle orb is an alternative that lets you have the sword one level higher earlier, with the Grand Palace orb as a safety if you didn't go get the Imperial Castle orb; the tree orb would also function as a safety, since it specifically sets you to 7th, but whatever, more safeties isn't really a bad thing.

I think that's all accurate. It's kind've convoluted to sort out the patch conflicts and what the end result is.

I see, thanks.

hmsong

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2069 on: April 21, 2021, 06:16:22 am »
Hey, did you change the location of Eggplant Man in the ancient city train?  Specifically, for the return trip train?  Obviously, it was done to prevent them from being farmed as easily (a good idea, really).  I'm just wondering which patch did that.

Pethronos

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2070 on: April 21, 2021, 07:00:12 am »
Your "Equipment Tweaks" patch repositions that enemy, if I remember correctly ;D

hmsong

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2071 on: April 21, 2021, 08:06:55 am »
Your "Equipment Tweaks" patch repositions that enemy, if I remember correctly ;D

I'm a freaking idiot.  I must have a brain damage or something, to forget my own patch.

Josenev

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2072 on: April 25, 2021, 10:54:47 am »
Hello one more time, I'm glad to show you the current progress of this new graphic theme.

This time I work the walk side animation sets of the characters, I put a preview animated GIF x3 and a preview animated GIF in real pixel size:



For the current animations I took the characters animations from Seiken Densetsu 3 as a reference (Hawk, Angela and Carlie)

I show you the frames sets with the game tiles, I guess they fit properly, but I'm not actually 100% sure about that, I use the SOMEDIT to take the references.
Any help about that would be greatly appreciated.
(the colors tiles are the repeated tiles, there are a JPG x3 and a PNG real size)



 On another front... Hi ManaRedux!

I think that the serious look is beacuse the pixel line in their foreheads, I think I fixed it by changing the bright.



I'm still figuring out how work the other issues, but I assume this is about to play with the color palette.

As I said las time, anything of this pixelart work is liable to be change. Thanks in advance for the help and the responses.



Spooniest

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2073 on: April 25, 2021, 11:41:46 am »
Whoa holy shanikeys!

Looks gorgeous duder, keep it coming :D You're real good, dang.
Yamero~~!

Stifu

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2074 on: April 25, 2021, 03:07:58 pm »
Queue: nice hack, thanks for making it!

Josenev: cool sprites. They look more polished than the originals, but I also think they're too detailed / harder to read. Like, I'd give the boy fewer strands of hair, and use simpler color clusters. Let me know if you'd like me to make a quick edit.

By the way, I liked it better when the girl was slightly shorter than the boy, so all 3 heroes have different heights. I don't like the redesigns that make the girl taller than the boy. The changes they made make the whole game looks more childish to me.

What's your goal? Do you plan to remake all characters?

Queue

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2075 on: April 25, 2021, 05:01:26 pm »
Josenev, wow, those are coming along nicely.

Okay, let's see where things stand.

I think you're still slightly over budget on color count. As examples: In the case of the girl, I think you just have two slightly different whites, so they're trivially merged; For the boy, I found a stray reddish-brown (200/72/48) color that was barely used, and a very light pink that could probably be merged with white; The sprite has a hair color and skin color that could probably be merged.

The absolute limit for each character is 15 colors. The boy's darkest color is the color of all shadows in the game (heroes, monsters, bosses, townsfolk, treasure chests; everything), so it's ideal to make sure you like whatever his darkest color is as a shadow color. A second ideal would be to keep the girl to 14 colors to match vanilla (because her unused color can be repurposed), but that's not essential, more like a request.

You used a color to anti-alias the baked-in shadows, but there's a good chance that wouldn't look good in-game with the wide variety of ground colors and that's assuming the default oval shadows are disabled for the heroes (otherwise those pixels would be visible against the default oval shadow placed under the heroes).

For tiles, it looks like you have them all fit within the vanilla constraints, which is excellent. To be precise, your boy frame 3's upper tile would need to be shifted right another pixel, but that's minor (sorta, I know adjusting a tile's worth of art can be anything but minor).

The next limit to keep in mind is that you don't realistically have control over how many frames are in an animation. So the horizontal walk animation is just 4 unique frames in a 6 frame loop (1,2,3,4,3,2), like how you have it for the sprite. The upward walk animation is only two(!) unique frames, with each being horizontally mirrored to pad it out to a 6 frame loop. The downward walk animation is 4 unique frames, but two of the frames aren't near the others numerically (3, 4, 211, 212), probably because 211/212 were added later when they realized mirroring the asymmetrical boy looked bad.

Running animations also use some of the walking animation frames, so keep that in mind when you progress to the running animations.

ManaRedux

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2076 on: April 26, 2021, 02:04:41 am »
Can someone confirm the following...

1)You can avoid Spikey Tiger's drop attack if you stand against one of the walls.
2)You can Magic Rope out of the Snap Dragon (Grand Palace) fight (if so, is this a bug?)
3)The best way to avoid Tropicallo's pumpkins is to either stand at the corners of his arena or the doorway -OR- stand underneath the pumpkins as they're dropping and then get out of the way. 

Mr X

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2077 on: April 26, 2021, 04:15:51 am »
Can someone confirm the following...

1)You can avoid Spikey Tiger's drop attack if you stand against one of the walls.
2)You can Magic Rope out of the Snap Dragon (Grand Palace) fight (if so, is this a bug?)
3)The best way to avoid Tropicallo's pumpkins is to either stand at the corners of his arena or the doorway -OR- stand underneath the pumpkins as they're dropping and then get out of the way.

Yeah 3rd one is true I always did that in vanilla, in Turbo now I just manual block Tropicallo's pumpkins.

Haven't tried the 1st and 2nd, will test at some point today.

hmsong

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2078 on: April 26, 2021, 06:55:47 pm »
Can someone confirm the following...

1)You can avoid Spikey Tiger's drop attack if you stand against one of the walls.
2)You can Magic Rope out of the Snap Dragon (Grand Palace) fight (if so, is this a bug?)
3)The best way to avoid Tropicallo's pumpkins is to either stand at the corners of his arena or the doorway -OR- stand underneath the pumpkins as they're dropping and then get out of the way.

1 and 3, I can't really test it as easily, since the enemy targets my allies instead if I'm in one of the corner/walls.
2 though... That's a great finding.  Devs missed that one.  Everyone did (for so long).  I hope this place doesn't share maps with anywhere else.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2021, 08:12:53 pm by hmsong »

Queue

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Re: Secret of Mana, Turbo - Beta 210419
« Reply #2079 on: April 27, 2021, 03:42:16 am »
I've been aware of the Snap Dragon Magic Rope issue for quite some time. As far as I know, it doesn't break the game. If you haven't defeated him, you can just go back to the room and fight him. I haven't tested thoroughly to see if there's some specific way you can break the game (i.e. make it unwinnable), like maybe if you use it at the right moment during his defeat, but I don't intend to "fix" it unless it can actually break the game.

I'd call it an oversight more than a bug, but yes, it's surely unintentional.

It's like being able to sequence break early game stuff so the girl and / or sprite join the boy in the goblin village cutscene: harmless, funny, doesn't break the game.

The reason I made bug fixes for some sequence breaks (or other similar "fun" bugs), for example the "pure land skip", is because those bugs can get you stuck (or worse), and then if you save after it's broken, the only fixes are restarting or editing event flags.

Anyway, here's a picture related to some bug fixing and experimenting: