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Dragon Quest Delocalized Projects

Started by Chicken Knife, September 02, 2018, 04:17:10 PM

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MD_Prometh

@choppasmith Any plans to port over the mobile DQ I/II scripts to the SNES/SFC version? I look forward to when III on NES gets the same treatment, for me, DQ without the Olde English isn't DQ.

Choppasmith

Quote from: MD_Prometh on July 10, 2022, 03:38:01 PM@choppasmith Any plans to port over the mobile DQ I/II scripts to the SNES/SFC version? I look forward to when III on NES gets the same treatment, for me, DQ without the Olde English isn't DQ.
That's the plan, but please, this thread isn't about my project. The Delocalized team deserves love too.  :thumbsup:

dewhenson07

#422
so when is the delocalized version of dragon warrior 4 gonna be made i mean theres already 1 2 3 and monsters so why not 4

Chicken Knife

Quote from: dewhenson07 on July 11, 2022, 08:04:51 AMso when is the delocalized version of dragon warrior 4 gonna be made i mean theres already 1 2 3 and monsters so why not 4
Hey dewhenson07. You could read up over the last several posts and I discuss that I'd love to, but why we aren't going that route right now.

Midnight Metronome

#424
I just noticed today that delocalized for DW2 is not compatiable with the doubled hack which doubles experience to reduce grinding. DW1 delocalized and doubled work together. But when moving on to DW2, as soon as a random encounter starts the game crashes. Any way to make them compatible? Thanks.

Chicken Knife

Quote from: Midnight Metronome on July 18, 2022, 12:48:34 AMI just noticed today that delocalized for DW2 is not compatiable with the doubled hack which doubles experience to reduce grinding. DW1 delocalized and doubled work together. But when moving on to DW2, as soon as a random encounter starts the game crashes. Any way to make them compatible? Thanks.
I'm surprised this is the first time I've heard of this, but yes, I confirmed that it's an issue. I happen to be going away on vacation for the rest of the week, so I can't do any testing for the time being. If I can't eventually figure the issue out, I'll reach out to abw &/or Psyklax to see if they have any thoughts. I'm aware of how popular the gold/xp doubling patches are, and I'd like to accommodate compatibility.

abw

It looks like both patches try to make use of the same free space in different ways. Psyklax's Doubled patch puts code smack dab in the middle of the tiny bit of free space in the fixed bank, so there's not enough room left on either side to fit the code Delocalized wants to put there :(. The Delocalized code is an alternate version of $F3E2 that reads pointers from $9000,X instead of $8000,X and is probably only used for the monster list (unless you started calling it from more places?). We can shorten that code by a few bytes, but that still isn't enough to fit in the fragments of free space left in the fixed bank. It would be a lot easier to rewrite the Doubled patch to just use some of the free space in the same bank as the code it's modifying... but it looks like we ought be able to cram our code into bank 6 in the chunk of free space starting at 0x01BFC7 / $06:$BFB7 which appears to still be unused by Delocalized.

$F3E2 leaves bank 6 loaded and doesn't mess with X, so if we replace 0x03F3E7 / $0F:$F3D7 (JSR $F19F) with JSR $BFB7 and then at 0x01BFC7 / $06:$BFB7 do:
LDA $9000,X
STA $57
LDA $9001,X
STA $58
JMP $F19F
I think (but haven't actually tested) that that should make both patches compatible.

Midnight Metronome

#427
Hi, I also noticed a problem in dragon warrior 3, delocalized + localized gold/xp. After speaking to the king, going back to town I was speaking with people and came to the person you can speak to to add party members. I chose ADD party member, even though it's just the beginning and you have nobody, he just asked to save, I chose no, then I spoke to him again and chose another option and the game crashed.

You might also want to check if delocalized and doubled actually work properly in Dragon Warrior 1, because now that I think about it, although it didn't crash, there was still a crazy amount of grinding. I can't imagine that the normal game would require nearly double the amount of grinding. Doesn't seem right.

MD_Prometh

I'm looking forward to the next update for the Hairy_hen FFVI patch, which has been strongly hinted at a few weeks back.

Back on the topic of DQ, are there any plans to do a delocalised patch for DQVII? I know there's two official localisations, with the PS1 version being more like the old translations and the 3DS one which has accents.

Chicken Knife

#429
Quote from: abw on July 18, 2022, 06:12:22 PMIt looks like both patches try to make use of the same free space in different ways. Psyklax's Doubled patch puts code smack dab in the middle of the tiny bit of free space in the fixed bank, so there's not enough room left on either side to fit the code Delocalized wants to put there :(. The Delocalized code is an alternate version of $F3E2 that reads pointers from $9000,X instead of $8000,X and is probably only used for the monster list (unless you started calling it from more places?). We can shorten that code by a few bytes, but that still isn't enough to fit in the fragments of free space left in the fixed bank. It would be a lot easier to rewrite the Doubled patch to just use some of the free space in the same bank as the code it's modifying... but it looks like we ought be able to cram our code into bank 6 in the chunk of free space starting at 0x01BFC7 / $06:$BFB7 which appears to still be unused by Delocalized.

$F3E2 leaves bank 6 loaded and doesn't mess with X, so if we replace 0x03F3E7 / $0F:$F3D7 (JSR $F19F) with JSR $BFB7 and then at 0x01BFC7 / $06:$BFB7 do:
LDA $9000,X
STA $57
LDA $9001,X
STA $58
JMP $F19F
I think (but haven't actually tested) that that should make both patches compatible.
abw, thank you so much for jumping in on this and sorry for the delayed response. I inputted the new JSR and the code as you prescribed, converting to hex manually as so:

BD0090
8557
BD0190
8558
4C9FF1

The problem is that the game is crashing on battles after doing so, even before I apply the doubled patch.

Quote from: Midnight Metronome on July 20, 2022, 02:50:48 AMAfter speaking to the king, going back to town I was speaking with people and came to the person you can speak to to add party members. I chose ADD party member, even though it's just the beginning and you have nobody, he just asked to save, I chose no, then I spoke to him again and chose another option and the game crashed.
I just tested this and I'm not getting any crashes with the localized gold/xp applied. If you can, I'd start over from a fresh ROM and see if you can reproduce it. If so, get the exact steps.

Quote from: Midnight Metronome on July 20, 2022, 02:50:48 AMou might also want to check if delocalized and doubled actually work properly in Dragon Warrior 1, because now that I think about it, although it didn't crash, there was still a crazy amount of grinding. I can't imagine that the normal game would require nearly double the amount of grinding. Doesn't seem right.
I can see via youtube videos that incorporated that patch that it does work.

Quote from: MD_Prometh on August 03, 2022, 12:57:44 PMI'm looking forward to the next update for the Hairy_hen FFVI patch, which has been strongly hinted at a few weeks back.

Back on the topic of DQ, are there any plans to do a delocalised patch for DQVII? I know there's two official localisations, with the PS1 version being more like the old translations and the 3DS one which has accents.
Hairy_hen had mostly left Kefka's text in its localized state, so we discussed our team providing new versions of Kefka's lines. We completed that project several weeks ago and forwarded the results to Hairy_hen. Ball is in his court now, but I can tell you that he has some other improvements in mind as well before the next release. That was one of the two projects I mentioned; the other was a complete retranslation soon to be released.

As far as DQ7 Delocalized, we have no direct plans. But as always, if some very technically savvy individual were to show up and want to collab on something like that, we would be open to discuss.

AdamDravian

Quote from: Chicken Knife on August 08, 2022, 11:11:13 PMHairy_hen had mostly left Kefka's text in its localized state, so we discussed our team providing new versions of Kefka's lines. We completed that project several weeks ago and forwarded the results to Hairy_hen. Ball is in his court now, but I can tell you that he has some other improvements in mind as well before the next release.

Oh, this is incredible news. FFVI is one of my favorite games, and I'm really looking forward to seeing your team's Kefka treatment.
Writer of the '80s-themed webcomic Satan Ninja 198X

abw

Quote from: Chicken Knife on August 08, 2022, 11:11:13 PMThe problem is that the game is crashing on battles after doing so, even before I apply the doubled patch.
*checks* Ah, right, the whole point of the original exercise was to move the monster list to bank 7 to take advantage of the enormous block of free space there, so it's actually bank 7 that's left loaded at the end of $F3E2, not bank 6, and the JSR and code should thus go to some free space in bank 7. It looks like your current monster list ends at 0x1D3D6, so you could locate the shortened code at e.g. 0x1D3E0 and then replace 0x03F3E7 / $0F:$F3D7 (JSR $F19F) with JSR $93D0. Sorry about that!

Chicken Knife

#432
Quote from: abw on August 09, 2022, 09:09:48 PM*checks* Ah, right, the whole point of the original exercise was to move the monster list to bank 7 to take advantage of the enormous block of free space there, so it's actually bank 7 that's left loaded at the end of $F3E2, not bank 6, and the JSR and code should thus go to some free space in bank 7. It looks like your current monster list ends at 0x1D3D6, so you could locate the shortened code at e.g. 0x1D3E0 and then replace 0x03F3E7 / $0F:$F3D7 (JSR $F19F) with JSR $93D0. Sorry about that!
Thank you for the follow-up, abw. The Delocalized patch itself is working again with these changes, but when I apply the doubled patch to it, the battles bork yet again. There must be some other remaining issue.

abw

Quote from: Chicken Knife on August 10, 2022, 06:44:35 AMThank you for the follow-up, abw. The Delocalized patch itself is working again with these changes, but when I apply the doubled patch to it, the battles bork yet again. There must be some other remaining issue.
Hmm. The Delocalized patch updates the JSR at 0x03F3E4 / $0F:$F3D4 from "JSR $F3E2" to "JSR $FF97" and then inserts new code at $FF97, but since we're moving that code into bank 7, we a) don't need to write that code to the fixed bank anymore and b) don't need to change the target of the JSR at $F3D4 anymore. Reverting both of those Delocalized changes and then applying the changes I provided makes both patches work for me. If you only applied my changes without reverting the Delocalized changes, that would definitely be bad, as we would end up still calling $FF97 which would run part of our old code and then hit Psyklax's Doubled code, which in this case cuts in right after the 20 byte of a JSR opcode and changes the JSR's target address to $260A; that definitely borks some battles!

Chicken Knife

#434
This worked, and I just published the update. Many thanks, abw!

*PS

Everyone who follows our work, please look out for a news article from ShadowOne333 that should release later this week. It will showcase a new retranslation of ours that we previously mentioned. It was a great project to work on, and I'm excited to finally get it out in the wild.

lilpuddy31

#435
Quote from: Chicken Knife on August 16, 2022, 07:23:46 AMEveryone who follows our work, please look out for a news article from ShadowOne333 that should release later this week. It will showcase a new retranslation of ours that we previously mentioned. It was a great project to work on, and I'm excited to finally get it out in the wild.

Don't let me down Shadow 😆

Ok, for those wondering about Translation Quest's mystery side project that I referenced earlier in the thread:  ShadowOne333 has released an update for Leged Of Zelda: A Link To Past - Redux which includes a brand new retranslation by the Translation Quest team

AdamDravian

That's incredible news. I'm looking forward to seeing my favorite translation team's take on one of my favorite games.
Writer of the '80s-themed webcomic Satan Ninja 198X

Chicken Knife

Thank you guys! Any feedback is welcome. The just released news article links to a comparative google sheet for those who want to see how our translation directly compares to the original localization or the Japanese script.

Polari

Hi, I recently finished my first playthrough of DQ3, using this patch. I don't have too much to say in general as I haven't experienced the other versions and wouldn't know if something's better or worse there, but one choice that stood out to me was the first time you talk to the old man in New Town.

The quest there is to bring a merchant to him, by going back to create a new character and edit your party. This is quite unusual, especially if you went with the suggested characters and chose not to change classes later, in which case there's a good chance you've forgot merchant is even a player class.

The more typical thing one would expect the game would want from you is finding a merchant NPC somewhere out there, so both the original script and Dragon Warrior III explicitly mention "a low level" as a context clue. The Delocalized patch uses a more generic description of "a novice merchant". Was this a deliberate change?

Chicken Knife

Quote from: Polari on August 28, 2022, 05:44:16 AMHi, I recently finished my first playthrough of DQ3, using this patch. I don't have too much to say in general as I haven't experienced the other versions and wouldn't know if something's better or worse there, but one choice that stood out to me was the first time you talk to the old man in New Town.

The quest there is to bring a merchant to him, by going back to create a new character and edit your party. This is quite unusual, especially if you went with the suggested characters and chose not to change classes later, in which case there's a good chance you've forgot merchant is even a player class.

The more typical thing one would expect the game would want from you is finding a merchant NPC somewhere out there, so both the original script and Dragon Warrior III explicitly mention "a low level" as a context clue. The Delocalized patch uses a more generic description of "a novice merchant". Was this a deliberate change?
Well, I can definitely confirm that we didn't introduce or change anything with this particular game mechanic, other than retranslating the text. It is certainly an odd mechanic, but keep in mind that these were the formative years for JRPGs, and genre norms weren't exactly established yet.

As far as the text "low level" vs "novice," I can see your point that the mention of "low-level" is slightly less ambiguous, but our main goal was to be faithful to the language of the Japanese version. If you go through DQ2 for instance, a famously cryptic game, there were times that our renderings made objectives clearer, and there were other times that we made objectives a little more obscure. We've only rarely made "improvements" to the Japanese text, reserving those for scenarios where there was an unequivocal flaw in the original text.

We appreciate you playing through DQ3 Delocalized and providing feedback, but unfortunately, we are inclined to stick with our translation in this case.