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Sonic 5 - Improvement Vol.2 (Nes)

Started by sics, May 14, 2018, 12:26:09 AM

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Clown mouth to go with the white.

I wanted to draw real human teeth but that proved tricky at that small scale.

Obviously sics knows what he's doing. The title screen color being slightly off was minor compared to the effort involved to get the complete image (and animations!) looking good.


First, if I had all the answers, I would not open a query thread, secondly, it is a bit ironic that you tell him that his opinion does not count since I owe him indirectly to have been able to carry out the new title screen and lastly and most importantly, the Picture made me laugh anyway :laugh:

Quote from: tygerbug on October 16, 2020, 07:29:14 PM
You can modify nametables in NES Screen Tool.

Export your nametable for any scene from the Mesen emulator's Memory Tools.

Here I am looking at Nametable RAM, including what looks like the palettes at bottom. Save the nametable RAM as a file.
Open this up in a hex editor. It's twice as big as it should be. Delete the second half of the file from 400 onward. Rename to .NAM.
Import CHR graphics into shiru's NES Screen Tool. Open your NAM file.

Recreate your palettes manually I guess.

At this point you can alter your background sprites and palettes, and save the results to be copy/pasted back into the ROM later. You can also create onscreen sprite displays as a metasprite bank.

You can use NES Screen Tool like a drawing tool here, placing tiles and palettes. Check or uncheck "Apply Tiles" and "Apply Palettes."
The .bin data you save when you're done can be manually reinserted into your NES ROM in the appropriate places.

   In Mesen (or in your old DMP file), copy a few bytes/numbers from the unaltered nametable and search for THAT in the NES file.

  Find this data inside the original ROM in a hex editor.

  (Either in a Hex editor or in FCEUX's Hex editor. Open up Debug/Hex editor/ROM file, you will be able to see your changes in real time. I suppose Mesen can do this too.)

  You have found the Nametable for this scene inside the ROM.

  You may be able to simply copy/paste your new/altered Nametable info directly into the ROM (from the .BIN file you exported from NES Screen Tool, or from an .MSB if you were working with sprites).

   However, the code in the actual ROM may be different and more complex than that - there may be extra commands which jump around the screen, like maybe a three-byte command on every line break, or commands which seek to a specific point onscreen.

   So you may need to make changes to your code to account for that.. Compare your new code to the old hex code.

   Try this in FCEUX's hex editor, while working with the CHR ROM. See if you're breaking the code by pasting in the new code.

  (It depends on the ROM!

  They often have some extra code which you have to work around, in the actual Nametables.
  Maybe an extra three bytes before every line of sprites, and an extra three bytes in the middle of the color palette at the end.
  It's not too hard though! Just something to look out for, and add to your new code!)

Although I did not use the method described by him, I put my eyes on "NES Screen Tool" and realized that I could use this tool in a similar way to what I was already doing with Tiled, this literally opened up endless possibilities for me, now I can have in hours what used to take me weeks :beer:

By the way, next time you say I know what I'm doing, keep in mind that I was about to add versions with the following designs:

I am honestly not convinced by the idea of ​​using the white color, since it would stand out much more than the other colors, so I could not integrate it correctly in the current sprite.

On the other hand, if the conditions to edit the characters improve, I would like to continue experimenting with Sonic's design, for example a while ago I adapted the design of another artist in a style similar to that of NES (Although at the moment without taking into account the actual hardware restrictions)

Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.


  My point was just that the peach color is standing in for both white and some flesh tones, and it's probably more important that the white parts look white. (Eyes, shoes, gloves etc)

  He has a similar design to Felix the Cat who was black and white (and had two NES games).

  But your choice obviously.


sics, you are way too humble.

Quote from: tygerbug
My point was just that the peach color is standing in for both white and some flesh tones, and it's probably more important that the white parts look white. (Eyes, shoes, gloves etc)
I figured, the suggestion got me to quickly doctor the image to see what white would look like (as I too was curious why he went with peach eyes), and it instantly made me think clown makeup. His ears, arms and stomach being ghostly pale look worse than his eyes, gloves and shoes being peach.

What I meant by "sics knows what he's doing" is white seems like a natural choice so it also seems unlikely that he wouldn't have tried it but still settled on peach. Aside from his skin looking bad as pure white, it's apparent that white just looks harsh as a color on Sonic in general (within the context of the player controlled sprite against the environment), and given how long sics has been working on this, again, it seems impossible that he hasn't gotten a feel for what colors work.


Exactly, I never said that the idea would not work, but I do believe that with current designs it would be difficult to make it work.

On the other hand, I do not consider it ideal to cite Felix as a reference, since he is white, so it makes perfect sense that they choose that color. Not to mention that it is currently believed that this was the reason why its developers decided to tone down the colors of the game.

Returning to Sonic, we must also consider the disadvantages of this change, for example Eggman, the Buzz Bomber and other enemies would now camouflage themselves in the clouds or other white background sectors, in addition this color would become the lightest tonality of all the palettes, reducing the chances of creating contrasts, not to mention that white is considered by many to be the absence of color.

That is why I would like you to not think that I am not seriously considering your proposal, it is more likely if I had not joined Jabu's project, another would have been the artistic direction that I would have adopted :thumbsup:

(Third design from Sonic 2016)
Exact (Really short answer)
Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.

Green Jerry

In woring's hack (Talui Adventure) when you destroy a monitor they disappear with a puff of smoke, why wasn't that added to this hack?
My latest Portuguese translation: Titanic (NES)


Do I need to invest in this hack? Sound of some kind, such as destruction - Yes, you can add, but the smoke is at the discretion of the most author: sics


It's that I didn't actually copy your code, but recreated the changes on my own, I hadn't noticed that happening when destroying a monitor :-\

Anyway, I think the fairest thing is to let your project grow and support it as much as possible, so unless it is an absolute necessity I don't want to take more features from your hack :thumbsup:

They have no idea how excited I am to see another hacker interested in improving this game, so the next tutorial to edit the transition screens is secretly dedicated to him, for giving Luigi the place he deserves, truly a genius! :beer:

I can't translate what you say correctly, but I think the author opened a query thread in order to listen to queries :D

On the other hand, getting a composer to create new sound effects for the game is a growing need for this project.Personally, I would love to have professionals of the stature of elPatrixF, although that is only a dream :laugh:

Note: The update has already been sent
Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.


He asked you: "why is there no smoke from the destroyed monitor?"
I say, " this smoke depends on the author of this hack."

I mean, you know better. Whether to add this feature or not... in that sense...

And it's the translator's fault that people don't understand me. Some people say I'm weird. 

(I looked at the user page "green Jerry", it does not lead to the author of the hack " with green Mario") !!!


what is the difference between the two xdelta files Sonic Improvement Vol.2 (v1.4) and the hummer complete cause I don't know which one to download?


Quote from: blgmadresh0000 on October 26, 2020, 05:44:10 PM
what is the difference between the two xdelta files Sonic Improvement Vol.2 (v1.4) and the hummer complete cause I don't know which one to download?

I'm answering this easy question. Sonic Improvement Vol.2 (v1.4) - A patch that has the full changes made by the author of this project. Here the physics is corrected, the graphics are improved, partially changed - the levels to be more honest.

Тhe hummer complete  - graphic port from the pirate console from the HAMMER TEAM. Тhe physics remains original, we only touched the graphic part of the levels and that's it. Levels - original, not changed.


In short, they are two different games, although Somari is effectively a patch created to be applied to "Sonic Improvement Vol.2".

On the other hand, it should be clarified that despite the fact that the routes have practically not been modified, Hummer and Family Kid are not simple graphic editions, since many things have changed internally to make their levels more solid.

But now that I think about it, the main improvements in the Improvement version have only carried over to version 1.2 of the other patches.

You should update them, although hardly anyone plays them
Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.


It could be added for a future update, an ending with Sonic with the microphone as in Master System would be great, always Robocnick with the emeralds is  :-\, it could be the good and the bad ending  :thumbsup:


  This is from the deleted storyline in the Genesis MD version, which had Sonic rescuing his friends in the Sonic the Hedgehog band, and singing at the end. The Master System/Game Gear version reflects that in its ending somewhat.



I remembered it from a little Japanese manga


I would love to create alternative endings for this hack, but it would not be enough just to know how to write title screens, but it would require creating new programming that would manage the events that triggered each ending at least.

The positive thing is that by manually assembling each screen I managed to save a lot of space, on the other hand, at the moment the PacManfan64 proposal convinces me more, since it is closer to what one would expect from the end of Sonic 1, but it is too early to decide , since although the wishes are many, the limitations also :thumbsup:

I am currently doing everything in my power to continue understanding how each aspect of this section works, we will see what progress I achieve in the future  :beer:

Another aspect that I would like to improve is the demos that teach each level, although at the moment the only thing I discovered were two addresses in memory 0x0000f2 and 0x0000f3, of which the first establishes a countdown of how long an action should last and the other what action should be taken.

When I recover from a lesson I suffered I will ask this officially in the forum, but if someone wants to give me a hand to understand how to modify this feature before that much better
Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.

Prince Manic

I'm liking the new improvements so far, I may try to see in the The Cutting Room Floor about Scrap Brain being missing from the game itself and somehow restore this and hack add it to the Game.

So Far its becoming more like if it was Demade for NES.


Sics do you value for future updates and better understanding of the graphics engine an update of the main model of Sonic?

The model is great but I see it very "chibi" Japanese Super-Deformed :D (cartoon), I think there will be models closer to the more realistic classic look. ;)

is the main Sonic art design yours? or is it from Jabu ?


I forgot to mention, what mapper does this game use?  :huh:


Prince Manic
Thank you for your words! :beer:

Strange, I thought I had answered this question, I probably left the answer misplaced in some old notepad and forgot to post it, sorry ;)

To be honest, I'm not really interested in working on a new update at the moment, as I don't feel that people have a real interest in this project.

In the course of time I've realized that this work has gone quite unnoticed, I have not even managed to include it in Sonic Retro as the other versions :-\

On the other hand, even if I would consider continuing because of boredom, I like Sonic's current design, as its structure helps to make the best use of the NES palettes, so I also think it would be a good base to design the rest of the characters ;)

Maybe if I ever had a programmer to support me I'd like to try something new, but at the rate I'm going it's more likely that I'll end up learning ASM on my own before that happens :D

Finally, when you talk about the main design, do you mean the one you show in that screenshot? because if it is, I think it was created by Hummer Team...

If you talk about the design of the hack, Jabu created its bases, I guess it belongs to him, the rest of us, although we redrew many sprites, we just kept on giving shape to that design :thumbsup:

Note: I'm not studying ASM, just kidding.
Sir, don't you think it's a bit unnecessary to revive a post to query something you could have figured out yourself? There are specific applications to see that, and you can also check it from almost any NES emulator :P

(I'm not angry, I just think it's a bit disappointing to come across such a boring question ::))
Linktree  | Better a small finished project than a thousand giant ideas stuck in your system.