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SMB3 4th Run

Started by Mari42, February 29, 2016, 12:07:32 PM

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Mari42

Look at 6th post!!!

Quick Curly

Now that I saw your name, I realize that I've known you as an SMB3 hacker from your YouTube channel for at least an entire year before you revealed your intentions to officially make a full SMB3 hack release. Small world! :P

I tried out your 1-world demo so far. I like the new name for your previously untitled hack, SMB3 4th Run. A take of sorts on Super Mario Bros. 3: 2ND RUN.
"The third Super Mario Bros. game for the fourth run in the twelfth month on the 24th day of my second lifetime." Cosmic!

There are a few findings that I wanted to bring to your attention.

I've discovered this before on my own and in previous situations in other SMB3 hacks. When you have blocks close enough to an upward current in the water, Mario/Luigi can potentially get trapped inside of those blocks due to collision detection not being accounted for as a result of the current. In this case, as seen in the following screenshot, Mario/Luigi can swim out, but I just wanted to point out the potential course of action that a player can take in your level design choice, as sometimes, there's the possibility that a player will get stuck and not be able to get out, which will result in them either having to reset or waiting for the timer to run out, provided that there isn't infinite time (which would ultimately force the player to reset and probably not bother starting over again).



When one designs a level, the designer pretty much has to account for every possible thought process and potential action the player can take within any overall layout to make sure that they can complete a level and that there are ultimately no traps that they can't somehow manage to escape.

As another example for a possible situation that you want to avoid, if your level/an area in your level presents a challenge/puzzle that the player needs to solve in order to complete the level as a whole (as in, it isn't optional and cannot be skipped) then you have to make sure to put in some sort of reset pipe/door system so if the player messes something up, they can try again as many times as they need to so that you don't force them to have to lose a life just to be able to try again.

Which kind of leads into another finding I came across while playing your demo. It appears that you didn't modify the airship retreat points in the SMB3 Map Editor. If the player dies in the ship level, the airship retreat points don't account for your World 1 map changes. While the ship could be reached in the first screenshot below, once it moved again, it could no longer be reached.



Just to confirm, I did play through the ship level and completed the first world, and I thoroughly enjoyed your level designs and varieties so far. The extra room in the ship level before the Koopa Kid was a very nice touch, and a formula that I've tended to follow for my own SMB3 hacks. :)

To comment on referring to this demo version as "v1.1", as seen in the screenshot of your current title screen, I would suggest that you only refer to something as "v1.0" or higher when it's ready for its official main release. Perhaps this first demo would be best referred to as "v0.1" for the sake of historical significance. ;)

One thing I'm a bit concerned about is that it appears that you're using the original object and enemy data starting offsets for your modified levels, but your levels exceed the original game's object and enemy counts, which means there are original levels that you're overwriting, and if/when you try to edit those levels from their original starting points in the ROM, you'll overwrite your older level modifications, and ultimately everything will be messed up.
Since you're only 1 world into your hack so far, this shouldn't take as much effort to account for and fix as if you had already edited the ROM more deeply overall.
I would recommend doing what I suggested to you before elsewhere, which would be simply clearing out all the original game's levels and enemies, i.e. the "custom offsets" method. (Related posts to follow.)

Re: Super Mario Bros 3 (New inventory item help?)
Re: Super Mario Bros 3 level from scratch.

Like I mentioned before, you don't have to do this method, since it requires more involvement from you within a hex editor, and keeping a record of your new level starting points for each object and enemy data set. Therefore, my only other possible recommendation and solution for you is to either use the same or fewer number of bytes than the original level for each new design you make, or somehow manage to keep track of which original levels you overwrite, and never open those levels in SMB3 Workshop to edit them, so that you can have/keep your larger levels/areas.

Your modified Dungeon, a single area which points to itself, also has instances when some enemies don't show up because there are too many enemies within a small region, as the second hallway is on top of the beginning hallway. I realize that you might have discovered this through testing and intended it, as then, each time the player plays through this Dungeon, their enemy encounter experience could be different. However, this could make it incredibly easy when no enemies appear in the current hallway, or way too many appear and make navigating even more difficult than you possibly planned. Not to mention, this level, like many others, also exceeds the original number of bytes for objects and enemies.

To summarize, again, I really enjoy what you're putting together so far. However, please be advised that not accounting for the original number of 3-byte objects, 4-byte objects, and enemies in each level can and will quickly present major problems for your hack's overall plans and presentable state.

I apologize for the lengthy post, but I wanted to be thorough with my concerns.
Just so you know, I'm by no means trying to criticize your hack at all. I'm the kind of person who actually doesn't like to judge anything harshly, as I feel that generally, most people nowadays are too overly judgmental and unappreciative, focusing more on what they as individuals want for their own unique tastes and ideas that they don't want to implement or act on themselves, and not just enjoying what they can for what's already there. Your hack ideas and level visions are your own, and you shouldn't change them for me or anyone else. You have my support, and as always, I look forward to your continuous progress. Best of luck. :beer:

Mari42

#2
Quote from: Quick Curly on March 01, 2016, 06:26:49 PM
Now that I saw your name, I realize that I've known you as an SMB3 hacker from your YouTube channel for at least an entire year before you revealed your intentions to officially make a full SMB3 hack release. Small world! :P

I tried out your 1-world demo so far. I like the new name for your previously untitled hack, SMB3 4th Run. A take of sorts on Super Mario Bros. 3: 2ND RUN.
"The third Super Mario Bros. game for the fourth run in the twelfth month on the 24th day of my second lifetime." Cosmic!

There are a few findings that I wanted to bring to your attention.

I've discovered this before on my own and in previous situations in other SMB3 hacks. When you have blocks close enough to an upward current in the water, Mario/Luigi can potentially get trapped inside of those blocks due to collision detection not being accounted for as a result of the current. In this case, as seen in the following screenshot, Mario/Luigi can swim out, but I just wanted to point out the potential course of action that a player can take in your level design choice, as sometimes, there's the possibility that a player will get stuck and not be able to get out, which will result in them either having to reset or waiting for the timer to run out, provided that there isn't infinite time (which would ultimately force the player to reset and probably not bother starting over again).



When one designs a level, the designer pretty much has to account for every possible thought process and potential action the player can take within any overall layout to make sure that they can complete a level and that there are ultimately no traps that they can't somehow manage to escape.

As another example for a possible situation that you want to avoid, if your level/an area in your level presents a challenge/puzzle that the player needs to solve in order to complete the level as a whole (as in, it isn't optional and cannot be skipped) then you have to make sure to put in some sort of reset pipe/door system so if the player messes something up, they can try again as many times as they need to so that you don't force them to have to lose a life just to be able to try again.

Which kind of leads into another finding I came across while playing your demo. It appears that you didn't modify the airship retreat points in the SMB3 Map Editor. If the player dies in the ship level, the airship retreat points don't account for your World 1 map changes. While the ship could be reached in the first screenshot below, once it moved again, it could no longer be reached.



Just to confirm, I did play through the ship level and completed the first world, and I thoroughly enjoyed your level designs and varieties so far. The extra room in the ship level before the Koopa Kid was a very nice touch, and a formula that I've tended to follow for my own SMB3 hacks. :)

To comment on referring to this demo version as "v1.1", as seen in the screenshot of your current title screen, I would suggest that you only refer to something as "v1.0" or higher when it's ready for its official main release. Perhaps this first demo would be best referred to as "v0.1" for the sake of historical significance. ;)

One thing I'm a bit concerned about is that it appears that you're using the original object and enemy data starting offsets for your modified levels, but your levels exceed the original game's object and enemy counts, which means there are original levels that you're overwriting, and if/when you try to edit those levels from their original starting points in the ROM, you'll overwrite your older level modifications, and ultimately everything will be messed up.
Since you're only 1 world into your hack so far, this shouldn't take as much effort to account for and fix as if you had already edited the ROM more deeply overall.
I would recommend doing what I suggested to you before elsewhere, which would be simply clearing out all the original game's levels and enemies, i.e. the "custom offsets" method. (Related posts to follow.)

Re: Super Mario Bros 3 (New inventory item help?)
Re: Super Mario Bros 3 level from scratch.

Like I mentioned before, you don't have to do this method, since it requires more involvement from you within a hex editor, and keeping a record of your new level starting points for each object and enemy data set. Therefore, my only other possible recommendation and solution for you is to either use the same or fewer number of bytes than the original level for each new design you make, or somehow manage to keep track of which original levels you overwrite, and never open those levels in SMB3 Workshop to edit them, so that you can have/keep your larger levels/areas.

Your modified Dungeon, a single area which points to itself, also has instances when some enemies don't show up because there are too many enemies within a small region, as the second hallway is on top of the beginning hallway. I realize that you might have discovered this through testing and intended it, as then, each time the player plays through this Dungeon, their enemy encounter experience could be different. However, this could make it incredibly easy when no enemies appear in the current hallway, or way too many appear and make navigating even more difficult than you possibly planned. Not to mention, this level, like many others, also exceeds the original number of bytes for objects and enemies.

To summarize, again, I really enjoy what you're putting together so far. However, please be advised that not accounting for the original number of 3-byte objects, 4-byte objects, and enemies in each level can and will quickly present major problems for your hack's overall plans and presentable state.

I apologize for the lengthy post, but I wanted to be thorough with my concerns.
Just so you know, I'm by no means trying to criticize your hack at all. I'm the kind of person who actually doesn't like to judge anything harshly, as I feel that generally, most people nowadays are too overly judgmental and unappreciative, focusing more on what they as individuals want for their own unique tastes and ideas that they don't want to implement or act on themselves, and not just enjoying what they can for what's already there. Your hack ideas and level visions are your own, and you shouldn't change them for me or anyone else. You have my support, and as always, I look forward to your continuous progress. Best of luck. :beer:

The original object/enemy data is what I am working for the full version before this official release as I've tried to work on that. I'm mean I'm afraid that it might corrupt my levels that I have, because for some reason the SMB3 workshop was bugged when I modify my levels for prior to this situation. I know that I overwrote (which I can fix to get rid the original data) but if I meant bugged, I'm meant the objects was placed out of nowhere, when I changed the pointers for the object/enemy data/object set for some sort reason. So, I exit and get back to where I were and the object/enemies was placed back to where I already modified.  I don't know how did it happen, but I guess that was worth it that it works that way. I came up with the name for 4th run, because I think 3rd run could've been a name I was looking for but I don't know if its taken or not, because if not then that would've been that for my title. :)

I didn't know how the collision were precised, but I guess I might have to change that. I've already tested that like many times looks like that seems a bit off, so I'll get rid of that. :O  Um, the airship retreat point is what im having issues that I already modified it according this screenshot below.



I can't find the address in hex editor to get rid of the other ones, because once I add the retreat point it adds but stays infinitely as it set by default. Is there anyway I can address that kind of the issue? But, anyways I know its short but there are going to be some changes for this matter of time that I have to fix this, and make this official release for world 1, 2, and 3 then I have to continue onward for the rest of the world to change. My YouTube name was "Edward Reynolds" if you can see one of those videos I made. :)

Quick Curly

There are multiple airship retreat points, and some are in the same spots as others. You have to move them all.

Mari42

Quote from: Quick Curly on March 02, 2016, 12:26:27 PM
There are multiple airship retreat points, and some are in the same spots as others. You have to move them all.

So, they all are together?  :huh:

Mari42

#5
Previously, I've been doing my 1st attempt, and kinda rushed through this version which is why I haven't done this much after all. So, this
is my first release demo hack I've never published for my own self as of now I'm working in solo. So, this version I've worked so much only for World 1 and its been a year since I've been stop doing this project for so long and I've been doing some hex editing to put more levels in the different spot for each world which that may be for the next demo after this one. Of what I've made my progress so far I've added/changed:

- Hammer Bros. 1&2 to a different object from hilly to plain with a different form with 2 Hammer Bros.
- Looping autoscroll for World 1 airship.
- Traditional ship level after autoscroll segment including the palette changes.
- Plain tiles (Ground tiles) in Anchor Away.
- Mushroom House to the different spot on World 1 map.
- In level 3&6 includes water levels.
- Fortress with a different palette, and less sprites due to the sprite limitations on screen as I've tested.
- 1-5 underground to giant level with different palettes.
- Airship Retreat Point in 3 or (5?) different spots.
- World 1 included underground bonus area.

Screenshots:





























Spoiler
Level 1-6 upward pipe is added where the blooper (with babies) is and "R" represent reset once you entered the downward pipe, so you can start over again to get to the underground bonus area.
[close]



Hammer Bros. 1&2 (Hammer bros. 2 requires different sky palette with 1-up)









And that's the end of it! XD

The 3rd run will be released sooner, but right now I'm taking my time to commit my ROM hacks to add more levels in each world so you all can have fun playing this game.

ROM Hack Release: http://acmlm.kafuka.org/uploader/get.php?id=5052

Mari42

#6
Progress for my next demo:

I made a few changes for my ideas as I've gathered my info that will switch to a brand new world except world 8 will be change, but not with the palettes.

Changes:

World 1 - Grassland (as usual)

World 2 - Sea world

World 3 - Ice World

World 4 - Sky world

World 5 - Pipe World

World 6 - Desert World

World 7 - Giant World

World 8 - Bowser World (as usual)


Images:

World 3 - Ice World




World 4 - Sky World (Cloud tiles animation)


World 3 - I've change the animation rate/palettes. So, this one is taken from World 6 palettes that way I change the colors that is darkest to light from
Spoiler
blue to white
[close]
.

World 4 - I've been doing some hex editing/graphics to make the clouds to be animated, but its hard to find the tiles to replace in yychr. So, I draw to make an clouds to be animated unlike SMAS, but it animates the question block from the tank objects. For that, the tiles will exchange to unused animated tile set for question block in Tank objects.

To do :

- Change music/pointers/palettes/animation rate for the rest of World maps.

- Do more levels.

- Customize Auto-scroll.

- Replace tiles from the Object ROM Bank.

That's all what I will do until I make a full release! ;D

SMB3 4th v0.2 Preview.....

Preview