[M-Tee]

Joking of course, right?

Why release a buggy version as soon as you can, knowing tons of copies of the buggy version will be in circulation while only the small percentage that bothers to update periodically have anything close to a functional version?

...who do you think he is, a modern, major AAA blockbuster publisher?

[Grimlock]

I don't get this 'beta testing-phase'...

Why not release the patch, call it v1.0 and let the bug-reports (if any) be reported the 'natural' way?

/dACE

I think M-Tee summed it up well.  The idea is to weed out any remaining issues before it's released.  Chances are most people won't update their downloaded patch when a new version is released and that also goes for many websites that may put our patch up for download since we will have no control or input there.  We're already going to have to follow up with an update to allow for use on original hardware.  I figure those people (who play on original hardware) are more advanced users and are more likely to look for an updated patch than the average users.

Also, a big part of play testing is to help balance the difficulty of the game.  If 75% of the people playing the game report that it's very frustrating and difficult due to enemy placement then I know I need to do some additional modifications to enemy placement.

EDIT:  Another point I meant to make is that this is not your typical ROM hack, this is a major departure from the original Metroid.  Slope detection, custom palette and CHR swapping systems, invisible screen scrolling transitions, mid level music transitions, new abilities and weapons, new (additional) areas, screen loading code added to screens throughout, hidden screens, corner map and greater pause map...  and more (don't want to spoil).  The potential for bugs is there and thorough play testing in advance to weed them out is certainly justified.  We're pretty confident that we're bug free but we'd like to be sure.

Aren't you a bit too late for that?

I think beta testers have already been chosen.

Hmm seems a bit on the rude side there Thirteen 1355...  I stopped updating the list because I got busy with personal things, I may include additional people...


Regarding the Beta test:

So far we are still on but depending on how long it takes to get the final changes done I may have to scale back the size of the play testing group due to time constraints on my end.  I have a major project on the personal front that will be starting soon and it will limit my ability to manage such a large group of play testers (without causing a significant delay to the final release).  Hopefully that won't be the case.  Snarfblam just got the game ending coded and finalized which means we're extremely close to a 100% complete game! 

[bohdee]

Thanks for the friend support, we are expecting.

[dACE]

Joking of course, right?

Why release a buggy version as soon as you can...

Did I really say that?

Of course I expect Grimlock (and Snarfblam) have tested it - several times by now.
On top of that, there have been others, beside the two, testing it (mrRichard) and possibly others.

But hey - it was jus my opinion, nothing more.

/dACE

[Thirteen 1355]

You're just jaleous you're not getting it first 

[snarfblam]

But hey - it was jus my opinion, nothing more.

You're definitely welcome to share your opinion, but we do have good reason for wanting to do extensive testing. It's already been said, but we want to release something that is (genuinely) complete and polished. I know early access and "we'll patch the bugs as players find them" are common approaches these days, but I think the "get it right the first time" strategy is fitting for a mod of a game from the cartridge era, right? 

The first round of testing already showed us how easy it is for a very small group of people to overlook a lot of significant bugs. I figured out a long time ago that when you're working on a project, you tend to develop a form of tunnel vision. You have a specific idea of how something will behave because that's how you designed it to behave and there are just so many possible issues you overlook or never think to test for. It's better to have somebody with fresh eyes kicking the tires. And I'd bet money we'll still miss some things.

[Trax]

Amen to that...

Any game, ROM hack or not, should always be as polished as possible and thoroughly tested. Quality trumps quantity. And yes, complexity brings up more potential errors and bugs, that's a given, and with it, a lot more possibilities have to be tested, and it's not always possible to cover everything with only a few people. Rogue Dawn, without all the new gameplay, new music and new programming, would be a boring game. Everything that is not part of the original game engine is, by definition, untested. So more new things equals more testing needed...

I think I'll say it one more time: keep up the good work, guys!

[cospefogo]

I did not receive anything as well.
Maybe they have picked specific subjects among the interested people.

No problem for me...
Just anxiously waiting for any kind of "official" news!

[Grimlock]

I did not receive anything as well.
Maybe they have picked specific subjects among the interested people.

No problem for me...
Just anxiously waiting for any kind of "official" news!

No, we just haven't started play testing yet. 

[chikadubi]

Just in case. My email:
koh1fds@gmail.com

[Ziko]

Oh yeah, I forgot to add my email as well. Here it is: mw02261@gmail.com

[Gamerhenky]

gamerhenky@gmail.com

[cospefogo]

No, we just haven't started play testing yet. 

Thanks, Sire.

[Link]

Am dying for play this game, even in a beta state, maybe if I tell you I have only a few weeks to live you may send me that precious PM with the file?

I just cant wait!!!!

[Amaweks]

Just passing just to say that you guys are doing an awesome work with this hack. Take the time needed to complete the project. Congratulations for all the criativity and advanced ASM hack. 

[chikadubi]

maybe if I tell you I have only a few weeks to live you may send me that precious PM with the file?

Hey! It was my plan! :C

[Amaweks]

One question: Since you made profound changes in Metroid 1 engine, have you ever thought about releasing some hacking tools that allow others forum members to make similar changes?

[Grimlock]

One question: Since you made profound changes in Metroid 1 engine, have you ever thought about releasing some hacking tools that allow others forum members to make similar changes?

I believe Snarfblam is going to release the latest version of his Editroid editor alongside the Rogue Dawn release.  It's been a while since we talked about it so he'd have to confirm.  The new editor has the built in ability to expand a vanilla ROM to MMC3 increasing the available memory fairly substantially.  It also has CHR (tile sheet graphics) swap functionality that can be triggered at any point in an area with some simple screen loading code that can be placed in the editor.  Also you'll have the ability to edit tile physics.  There's a lot of new features compared to the current version available that really expand your editing potential.

[snarfblam]

It'll take a little work to get a general purpose version of Editroid out with the new features. Features that require editor support will be built into the ROM expansion. Other engine modifications are pure ASM.

[Seeeeph]

Totally agree that beta testing before releasing is a necessary step. We didn't took it seriously back when we released Parallel Worlds and guess what, it backfired. Most people who played the game disliked it, found it too tedious and harsh and it earned a cult sadomasochist status.

My Conker hack on the opposite side has already been beta tested four times in three years and we are close to release the private 'release candidate' that fixes all the bugs reported in the last beta of about one month ago. Once thats out of the way, I'll release the game which should be suited to most players with its rather easy difficulty :-)

Also glad your project is taking its beta testing seriously and cannot wait to give it a try. Good luck with your finishing process!