News: 11 March 2016 - Forum Rules
Current Moderators - DarkSol, KingMike, MathOnNapkins, Azkadellia, Danke

Author Topic: Steam entering the next stage  (Read 14785 times)

BRPXQZME

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4572
  • じー
    • View Profile
    • The BRPXQZME Network
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #20 on: September 27, 2013, 10:24:34 pm »
I can't find any source for Steam Machines being nvidia exclusive. This is a comment by nvidia just from yesterday: "Brian Burke: As far as your question about us landing in the Steam Machine, that is up to Valve."
I’m not saying that sourced, I’m saying that making an inference from available information. Check the package listing for the “hometest” repository, which is probably part of a test version of SteamOS judging from a number of things in it. Now, see any other drivers in there? I could be wrong, but I mean, it’d be really weird (even for Valve) to be working so close with one graphics hardware company to get these experimental drivers made/improved/required for the sake of altruism.

As for people who are in positions to make official statements, they’re often not allowed to say things ahead of time because then they’d be official statements, and that can be some very bad business. It plays into that whole problem of how like half of everything in games journalism is sunshine spoon-fed from those who want to sell things and half of the other half is lies. It’s... a long ladder of halves. Like, the next is probably bitching and moaning, the next is... well, somewhere down there is speculation, and that’s all wot I can provide to anyone for now. Anyway, it’s still bullshit all the way down ;)

That tweet reads so much like “We don’t say what our customers do with the widgets we make, we just make ’em.” A great non-answer that un-asks the question with tact and hopefully confirms whatever the asker already believed.
we are in a horrible and deadly danger

Jorpho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4191
  • The cat screams with the voice of a man.
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #21 on: September 28, 2013, 02:44:44 am »
Canonical's pretty much done what you've described. Their new window server's called Mir, and it bundles an X compatibility layer.
Ah, I have definitely not been following this news.  And of course there's already fighting, apparently.  How tiresome.
This signature is an illusion and is a trap devised by Satan. Go ahead dauntlessly! Make rapid progres!

KaioShin

  • RHDN Patreon Supporter!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
    • View Profile
    • The Romhacking Aerie
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #22 on: September 28, 2013, 02:44:59 am »
Where is that depository from? What exactly is it showing? It might just mean that Steam's test unit is using a nvidia card. Half of the other steam machines coming out might still be AMD. If they make such a big deal out of the box being so open, I'd be surprised if there was any exclusivity in this regard. If those will be nvidia exclusive, they can go f- off, I won't want one.

RE: Controller: I give them credit for trying something non-mainstream. But it still looks horrible. I don't believe that will work for anything (genre wise) well.
All my posts are merely personal opinions and not statements of fact, even if they are not explicitly prefixed by "In my opinion", "IMO", "I believe", or similar modifiers. By reading this disclaimer you agree to reply in spirit of these conditions.

Lilinda

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4539
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2013, 03:17:54 am »
The main issue with the controller is ironically, it doesn't have enough touchpads.

Let's use a real world example. Batman: Arkham Asylum(The sequel works just as well). It uses the dpad for switching between various gadgets, a left analogue stick to move, a right analogue stick to change camera angle, the main four face buttons for running/confirm button, countering, grabbing/cancel button, and attack. It also has various things mapped to the 4 shoulder buttons, along with start and select/whatever you want to call it button/s being used for things as well.

It doesn't have enough shit.
Retired moderator/staff member as of July 14th 2016

BRPXQZME

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4572
  • じー
    • View Profile
    • The BRPXQZME Network
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2013, 04:22:08 am »
Where is that depository from? What exactly is it showing?
It’s a repo that has a Steam boot splash screen among many other things that would strongly hint that it’s the core of SteamOS. It might be a rejected candidate, but seriously, what are the chances of that?

It doesn't have enough shit.
I think that won’t be an issue. You’ll probably see a lot of control schemes use the third triggers (the handle squeeze buttons on the back) to accomplish exactly what you’d accomplish on a dual-analog controller by moving your thumb from buttons to stick or stick to d-pad.
we are in a horrible and deadly danger

MisterJones

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1572
  • :D
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2013, 02:03:54 pm »

RE: Controller: I give them credit for trying something non-mainstream. But it still looks horrible. I don't believe that will work for anything (genre wise) well.

tom meat (programmer guy behind meat boy, who swears by gamepads) say it is actually fine:http://tommyrefenes.tumblr.com/post/62476523677/my-time-with-the-steam-controller

i still want some non gamepad friendly games tried on, like rts and space chem and shit
_-|-_

KaioShin

  • RHDN Patreon Supporter!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
    • View Profile
    • The Romhacking Aerie
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2013, 03:29:50 pm »

i still want some non gamepad friendly games tried on, like rts and space chem and shit

Europa Universalis? Or any WoW style PC MMO. At least it sparked my curiosity. Who knows, maybe I'll get chosen as tester :P
All my posts are merely personal opinions and not statements of fact, even if they are not explicitly prefixed by "In my opinion", "IMO", "I believe", or similar modifiers. By reading this disclaimer you agree to reply in spirit of these conditions.

Rhys

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 706
    • View Profile
    • CN
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2013, 04:46:50 pm »
The main issue with the controller is ironically, it doesn't have enough touchpads.

Let's use a real world example. Batman: Arkham Asylum(The sequel works just as well). It uses the dpad for switching between various gadgets, a left analogue stick to move, a right analogue stick to change camera angle, the main four face buttons for running/confirm button, countering, grabbing/cancel button, and attack. It also has various things mapped to the 4 shoulder buttons, along with start and select/whatever you want to call it button/s being used for things as well.

It doesn't have enough shit.

It seems to be designed to be a complete substitute for the usual WASD + mouse combo, with four extra utility buttons for anything extra the game might need. With arkham asylum doesn't it use the scroll wheel for switching weapons? In which case the controller has you covered, the scroll wheel mapping is shown on that diagram they've got.

MisterJones

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1572
  • :D
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #28 on: September 28, 2013, 06:40:16 pm »
it would be fun to bind all posible actions for some of the most complicated roguelikes
_-|-_

Real_Character

  • Restricted Access
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 171
  • A 16-bit character in a 2-bit world.
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2013, 05:31:24 pm »
I remain skeptic that anyone can actually make something consumer-level with Linux that won't promptly fragment into an ugly mess of poorly-supported forks.

Yeah, those android phones are always fragmenting to pieces.

I'm skeptical for different reasons. If it's too expensive I doubt it will sell too well. Most steam users are PC gamers and are Winbreds that couldn't give a shit about Linux. It remains to be seen how many people are interested in a steam console-ish thing. It will all depend on the cost and, if it's more native console than webtop it will depend on 3rd party support.

Panzer88

  • RHDN Patreon Supporter!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5009
  • GENO means ♥♪!?
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #30 on: October 28, 2013, 04:40:46 pm »
I think most people are missing something here.

PC gamers are always looking to upgrade, but none of them want Windows 8. SteamOS on the other hand is built for gaming with nothing else slowing it down. It can be used with an input device, while not optimal,  should be compatible with every game you own and allows high bandwidth human input (use both trackpads while pushing many buttons)

Most consumers will have no idea that it runs linux, just that it has.  "Teh steams" they are familiar with the term iOS so SteamOS will sound new and appealing. And will be more streamlined and mainsteam friendly than a traditional pc experience.

Sounds like it'll be as cheap or expensive as you want,  and you won't have to pay for the OS, so some people that want to build their own system might lean towards it because it'll be cheaper than building a Windows pc
Donate now until 24 April, from the makers of shotwell Geary: a new open-source email client

MisterJones

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1572
  • :D
    • View Profile
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #31 on: October 29, 2013, 01:05:50 am »
Unofrtunately you still need a windows pc for windows only games.
_-|-_

Rhys

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 706
    • View Profile
    • CN
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #32 on: October 29, 2013, 05:11:54 am »
Makes me wonder if Valve will just use winelib wrappers for existing PC games or bundle something like Crossover with SteamOS to boost the size of its library on launch

Kiyoshi Aman

  • RHDN Patreon Supporter!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2261
  • Browncoat Captain
    • View Profile
    • Aerdan's Blog
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #33 on: October 29, 2013, 07:36:37 am »
Canonical's pretty much done what you've described. Their new window server's called Mir, and it bundles an X compatibility layer.

Wayland/Weston was first. Intel won't do anything Mir-specific in their drivers, however much Canonical would like them to. The only thing Mir's done for the world is to make Wayland's devs get off their arses and actually get to work.

Ah, I have definitely not been following this news.  And of course there's already fighting, apparently.  How tiresome.

Open source is rife with politics when it comes to this kind of thing, particularly since X is so damn old.

BRPXQZME

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4572
  • じー
    • View Profile
    • The BRPXQZME Network
Re: Steam entering the next stage
« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2014, 11:00:04 pm »
A bump for those of you who don’t necessarily follow gaming news that closely:

A few days ago (at Steam Dev Days, a no-journalists-allowed-but-tweets-welcome event, which will certainly add all sorts of interpretive fun for days to come :D) they revealed that they’re dropping the touchscreen from the controller (at least from the “retail” version, if there will be more than one). This makes the design more down-to-Earth, though of course I’m sure this is disappointing for game designers. And by that, I mean probably just me; that is, I was kind of in the middle of designing a game that was supposed to take some sicknasty advantage of the proposed design shown last year. Good thing I don’t have the test hardware or a “let’s drop all obligations and just do this” work ethic to have actually tried implementing anything yet!

(In case the news was all you wanted, it should be clear at this point that the rest of this post is a bit more self-centered than it is informative.)

This also lets them move the inner buttons, supposedly for better compatibility with existing controllers. The placement of these seems likely to confound exactly the sort of person they are doing this for, though: they moved them to roughly where the analog sticks are on a DualShock, making it look something like a Wii U Pro controller with the sticks replaced with touchpad. And with a D-pad doesn’t look like a D-pad. The ABXY buttons are no longer next to both touchpads for convenience, but rather on the right for conventionality (kind of a loss in theory, but I’m not sure many people will be mourning that). So... there are some voices on the Internet giving this new revision the thumbs up, but let not your heart be troubled, I am not one of them :P

Then again, the present design was still deemed a WIP, and they’re reportedly still processing feedback from beta testers. We’ll see. That huge negative space in the center is so unaesthetic it can’t possibly last.

I can certainly grant that the placement of the planned touchscreen was potentially awkward and it would have added cost to the hardware for what would probably turn out to be very little gain overall, but one of the rationales that was apparently given for removing the feature was that it distracted gamers by presenting a wrong screen to look at (fair enough; I hear that the Wii U seems to be getting some bad design in this vein), and that a “ghost mode”—displaying where on the touchpads you are holding—would be a sufficient substitute. That’s not the case here; even without display functionality, a third touchpad (as on the PS4, for instance) would go a long way towards replicating the touchscreen controls I’m now shelving, and would still maintain the infinite-possibilities/rare-hotkeys ideal they seemed to be envisioning before.

EDIT: Lars Doucet played with the one he got
« Last Edit: January 21, 2014, 04:38:03 pm by BRPXQZME »
we are in a horrible and deadly danger