[GBA] Harvest Moon: Friends of Mineral Town - True Love Edition

[HolyDragoon]

Well... I'm not interested on boy-on-boy action, but I must admit opening the romance options like that sounds like a good initiative. After all, times chance, and if a same sex couple can be found kissing on a random city...

I just have a question. They're actually two questions, but the other one is more like a general thought that only has to do with the game.

1) Is it possible to make a selection screen for the gender? Or the necessary script changes would make that impossible?

2) I was wondering about this for a while now. Having a bar that gives the Stamina/Fatigue levels while you're at the Hot Spring. Is it possible, or is it too hard for the final result?

EDIT: Big derp there of my part, a couple 'killing'. 

[Vanya]

I haven't wanted to stir anything up with my opinion, but I don't really like the hack's subtitle. Calling "True Love Edition" might seem to imply that same sex relationships are inherently better. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for this and the boy version as well. I just think something like "Free Love Edition" would be more appropriate. Just my opinion.

What would be great as a next step, would be if it could be like "Fable" where you could play as any sex and have relationships with any sex as well.

[Garoth Moulinoski]

May I suggest a different name? the name is kinda misleading in that I think of the old pc dating sim "True love"
I think harvest moon friends of mineral town girl edition and more friends of mineral towns boy edition would work fine.

I haven't wanted to stir anything up with my opinion, but I don't really like the hack's subtitle. Calling "True Love Edition" might seem to imply that same sex relationships are inherently better. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for this and the boy version as well. I just think something like "Free Love Edition" would be more appropriate. Just my opinion.

Add me to this group. I mean, I won't play any of these hacks (because I'm not interested in either), but I did come here thinking it was some sort of new hack to the Harvest Moon GBA game, which I did like. Like Vanya said, the title is misleading and can imply that "same sex relationships" are better. Like implying a heterosexual relationship is the wrong way.*

Maybe what Vanya said, calling it "Free Love Edition" or something to that extent would be better. I would've still come in wondering what it was about, but I least I would've been "oh, alright, makes sense". Instead, now I just feel kinda... lied to... And that's not true love! </3

*although I guess straight people would have this coming after some years of persecution...

[danke]

Except that "true love" isn't defined by gender or societal standards.

As it's his hack, he can name it as he likes. I don't find the title misleading at all. I don't really know what you expect from a "True Love" hack, anyway. And since you have no intention of playing the hack, what's the harm?

[granz]

Calling "True Love Edition" might seem to imply that same sex relationships are inherently better.

Would you guys feel this way if the hack were themed around heterosexual relationships in some way? (e.g. one that makes more opposite gendered NPCs available for marriage) "True Love" is just another relationship idiom like "soulmate," and it's not exclusive to any one form of sexual orientation. There's nothing political about calling it "True Love" no more than if the hack were about giving the girl the option to marry more guys, or vice versa.

[Garoth Moulinoski]

Would you guys feel this way if the hack were themed around heterosexual relationships in some way? (e.g. one that makes more opposite gendered NPCs available for marriage)

I don't think so... Or maybe, not so limited in scope. Maybe making every NPC available for marriage? Or maybe making a hack where the dating sim parts are more pronounced (as in, you go on dates, instead of just giving the potential partner gifts and whatnot). Or where you and your partner grow old together (I don't know if Harvest Moon ever does do this).

Note that I don't say it has to be heterosexual, although that would be the way I'd play it (being heterosexual*).
*Maybe a bit asexual. Maybe. I don't know. Maybe like "hermitistic", as in, I'm all for falling in love with a woman, but couldn't care less if it didn't happen anymore. Not sure if that even makes sense.

Except that "true love" isn't defined by gender or societal standards.

But by the nature of this hack, and the title, it's implying that homosexual relationships are "true love". Leading to heterosexual relationships being... what? "The regular version"? It just feels weird.

As it's his hack, he can name it as he likes.

True. I was just noting that at least I, and a couple of others, felt the title was misleading and didn't properly tell me what the hack was about. It was a mere suggestion. It's not like I'm telling him "this title sucks! Change it now or forever DIE!"

And since you have no intention of playing the hack, what's the harm?

None. And I will probably forget about it and it won't affect (until one day, I decide I feel like playing Harvest Moon again and see this hack and start philosophizing over the title's name again).

[granz]

Being that Harvest Moon is a role-playing game, players want to put themselves in the role of the lead character. It's hard to do that when you're not heterosexual but the game confines you to heterosexual relationships anyway; hence the option of allowing gay players to experience "true love" as heterosexual players already have. It's not complicated.

... but you guys are heterosexual. (I guess?) The hack is geared toward a different demographic. If the concept of marrying someone of the same gender is not something you can identify with, then don't play it. I've avoided Harvest Moon games all this time for this very reason - the restriction on the relationship aspect limits my ability to immerse myself in the role. I'd really appreciate having this option after all.

[DarknessSavior]

The funny thing about all of this is that the Japanese versions allow you to pick either way by default. If you're playing as the girl, you can date girls or boys. If you're playing as the boy, same. They usually take this feature out when they translate it into English, though.

I do somewhat agree that the name might be a bit confusing. But I definitely like the idea of the hack.

I'm pretty sure everyone and their mother would have a fit if this was called the same name, but it was being edited for heterosexual relationships. I believe that's the point Moulinoski is trying to get across.

~DS

[Garoth Moulinoski]

... but you guys are heterosexual. (I guess?) The hack is geared toward a different demographic. If the concept of marrying someone of the same gender is not something you can identify with, then don't play it. I've avoided Harvest Moon games all this time for this very reason - the restriction on the relationship aspect limits my ability to immerse myself in the role. I'd really appreciate having this option after all.

I'm not saying that the content is "wrong". I'm saying that the title with the content combination is misleading. Its implication is that gay relationships are the right or true way to be. Which isn't wrong, but then what does that leave for heterosexual relationships? Are they the wrong way?

I feel like I've repeated myself three times already. The content is fine. I agree that a roleplaying game should let you choose your gender preference if its applicable (would be nice if there could be an option in future games with this mechanic to not have any relationships). It's the title of the hack that I find is strange and misleading. Thus a suggestion to the author to introspect what he meant with it. They can keep the title if that's their choice. No offense meant!

In the end, what I was trying to do, and what I think Vanya and Piotyr were trying to do, was to be helpful and provide some positive criticism.

[Lilinda]

I really like that this is being made, and I hope the Boys Edition of More Friends happens too.

Edit: also, for the record as someone best described as not straight, I think the true love name should be changed to like... something else as well. There is an accidental implication there. Perhaps Open Love edition or Gay Marriages Allowed edition?

I am terrible at naming things, I'm sorry.

[granz]

I'm not saying that the content is "wrong". I'm saying that the title with the content combination is misleading. Its implication is that gay relationships are the right or true way to be. Which isn't wrong, but then what does that leave for heterosexual relationships? Are they the wrong way?

I feel like I've repeated myself three times already.

I'm not saying you're saying it's wrong. The misunderstanding is converse. As I said earlier:

"Being that Harvest Moon is a role-playing game, players want to put themselves in the role of the lead character. It's hard to do that when you're not heterosexual but the game confines you to heterosexual relationships anyway; hence the option of allowing gay players to experience "true love" as heterosexual players already have."

You're reading too deeply into it and attaching some kind of political agenda that simply does not exist. The title never struck me as odd. It still doesn't; but you're asking the author to walk on eggshells to appease a preconceived notion involving semantics. It's silly that you guys can even take yourselves this seriously. That said, I've stopped caring. If the title is changed, it'll serve only as a reminder of the bizarre mentality of some of the people here on RHDN.

[Garoth Moulinoski]

Alright...

Let's say that we have a game where the original version let's you play as a boy (or a girl) and the objective was to marry someone of the same gender. Let's call it Game X. It's the vanilla version.

Now, someone comes along and makes a version of the same game where the objective is changed so now, you have to court a character of the opposite gender and calls that version of the game Game X: True Love Edition.

How do you feel about that? It isn't telling me that Game X has had its objective changed from same-sex relationships to heterosexual relationships. It's just telling me it's the "True Love Edition". Is it a Deluxe version of the game? Does it have more characters? Can I do more activities with my virtual significant other? I don't know!

Do you understand what I'm saying now? About the title? It sounds like it's a deluxe edition hack when it's an uni-functional hack (changes the gender of the player character to simulate same-gender relationships).

[DarknessSavior]

Alright...

Let's say that we have a game where the original version let's you play as a boy (or a girl) and the objective was to marry someone of the same gender. Let's call it Game X. It's the vanilla version.

Now, someone comes along and makes a version of the same game where the objective is changed so now, you have to court a character of the opposite gender and calls that version of the game Game X: True Love Edition.

How do you feel about that? It isn't telling me that Game X has had its objective changed from same-sex relationships to heterosexual relationships. It's just telling me it's the "True Love Edition". Is it a Deluxe version of the game? Does it have more characters? Can I do more activities with my virtual significant other? I don't know!

Do you understand what I'm saying now? About the title? It sounds like it's a deluxe edition hack when it's an uni-functional hack (changes the gender of the player character to simulate same-gender relationships).

Or simply reverse it. There are BL games out there in Japanese. Let's say someone modded BL Game X to make it straight, and called it BL Game X: True Love edition.

I'm fairly certain no one would like that for the same reason. It's just overlooked here for whatever reason.

~DS

[Garoth Moulinoski]

Or simply reverse it. There are BL games out there in Japanese. Let's say someone modded BL Game X to make it straight, and called it BL Game X: True Love edition.

I'm fairly certain no one would like that for the same reason. It's just overlooked here for whatever reason.

~DS

That's exactly what I was saying... (except applied to Lesbian relationships as well. Unfortunately, I didn't know how to include bisexualism in my example, but I hope that what I wanted to say was understood). Edit: Actually, this was only part of what I was saying.


Here's another example I thought of, one that removes the gender issue out of the picture so that we can get to the true heart of what I want to mean:

Say that I grab a game, let's say, Zelda: A Link to the Past. Now, say I go and make a hack where I replace a random NPC with Sonic (the Hedgehog). No, I call the hack Zelda: A Link to the Past - Sonic Special Edition. The title is misleading because it makes it seem like certain aspects of the original game (Zelda) will be replaced to resemble Sonic.

Back to Harvest Moon: I suppose if the hack allowed you to choose, in-game, to be either a boy or a girl, and allows you to, regardless of gender, to pick any character you wanted to court, the title might have made a little bit more sense (and even then, it's still not effective as there's a new implication: bisexualism is true love but gay and straight aren't).

However, granz, it's true that ultimately, this is Katai's hack (so the title is completely Katai's decision) and that in the end, I am not in the target audience. I just wanted to point something out to the author over the implications of the chosen title. And I kept up this discussion with you because I felt misunderstood (I felt like you were sidestepping my point rather than actually addressing them) and I guess I just wanted to be understood and not have any bad blood between us. :<

[Piotyr]

Ok uhhh, I just mentioned you should change the games title because there was a fairly popular dating sim released in english called "True love" that I was thinking "Hey he modded the true love girls into this?" I think I may be a minority but really I think open love does fit better than true love. This is a suggestion and you really shouldn't get your panties in a bunch over it.
And its not really offensive but it is certainly not pc either.

[Garoth Moulinoski]

Dang. This thread died quickly and I feel like it's my fault for insisting that the name is unfitting... Now I want to see this hack finished, no matter what it's called. It's selfish of me, but I'd feel guilty if the author ended up abandoning it because of "controversy" (which I may have escalated).

Katai! Call it whatever you want, just finish the hack eventually (in your own time, no rush). :<

[Katai]

Hahaha.  I'm amused that the most controversial part of this whole thing happens to be the name. 

My reasoning behind the name isn't too complicated.  The idea is that many fans of Harvest Moon have gone through their games, and really connect with certain characters.  Unfortunately, they have been unable to romance that character, and end up marrying someone else of the proper gender.  The mod, in essence, allows the player to marry their first choice (or "True Love") rather than settling for their #2 pick.

The name doesn't really matter.  I like it enough, and it's vague enough to make people take a look 

Anyway, I'm still working on spriting the Boy version of MFOMT.  I'm pretty stuck on the script editing.  I can't seem to locate/parse the pointer table.  I was told to try some debugging tools, but I'm pretty green in that area.

(Trivia: Apparently Popuri is really popular amongst the ladies.)

[Chpexo]

.

[Katai]

Buh, I've been working on sprite edits, I didn't pay attention to this thread.  You don't happen to have the address of the pointer table, do you?  I'm still not able to locate it (note sure what you mean by "big bank of text").

[crashdown]

I personally would love to see this hack get completed, particularly the boy version. Not just for the option for same sex relationships, but also for the option to play as a boy with the extra content from MFoMT.