Castlevania II (Simon's Quest) - Multilingual enhancement

[Pikachumanson]

Buuuuuut.... The castle only changes when Dracula is revived otherwise it would stay the same(albeit in ruins), and since dracula is not revived yet we can allow ourselves a nostalgia flashback to part 1. Errrr... That is, should Bisquit decide to go that route.

[MathUser2929]

I think in SOTN Dracula wasn't ressurected until Shaft ressurected him after Alucard defeated him, yet the castle was different from ROB. Also, I think in HOD GBA, the Castle was different from any time known before it, yet Dracula only partially ressurected at the end of it too.

[Pikachumanson]

Well, let's come to an agreement then. If Bisquit does decide to implement a Castlevania 1 look in Dracula's crypt it still wouldn't be same because remaking the first board probably wouldn't be feasible. But, maybe he can expand the crypt area a little so it has more of a castle feel since the castle can look like whatever it wants(chaos) then graphics from part 1 or maybe 3 are ok!

[MathUser2929]

I guess this is kinda similar to what that guy earlier said, but it would be easy to recreate what you want in the Stake editor for CV1. Just remove the candles and enemies. Especially since you want to use CV1 graphics. Unlike what the guy earlier said, you'd only have to edit it once and you can save the results to make a custom ROM, not constantly edit the RAM each time you game over and toggle the code on, return to the game, go to the cheat menu again, turn off the code, and resume the game. Editing the palette of Simon's sprite would be easy, maybe not so easy would be editing the graphics. But even if you didn't edit the palette and sprite, it would still feel the same. CV1 and 2 play the same for the most part.

They don't have the same items and weapons, sure. But in a enemyless level, they aren't that neccesarry.

[Bisqwit]

Regardless of what the decision will be about what should be done and what should not be done about level layouts, changing them is not about to happen quickly, because so far I have not yet managed to completely reverse engineer the level format. Leveldatawise I know about the actors, and about palettes, and about the max-levelups, but not about solids, exits and background graphics. (I know where all the tables are, just not what is the meaning of all data within them.) Granted, I have not spent nearly as much effort in it as I did in some other parts of the code.

Also, I am beginning to lose track of what has been suggested so far.

[optomon]

I've reverse engineered all of it. Maybe we should share some data.

[Bisqwit]

I've reverse engineered all of it. Maybe we should share some data.

That would be nice!

You can find my comprehensive disassembly of the ROM at: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/cv2fin/dev/dasm.zip (mods, feel free to delete this link if it defies ROM distribution policies, as it's technically possible to reconstruct the ROM from this disassembly).

[Fes]

Registered here just to say thanks for this amazing hack. Simon's Quest is one of my favorite games of all time, and this patch smooths out the rough spots and lets what's good about this game shine through. The map and sram saving in particular are such a natural fit, it really feels like they should have been there all along.

I definitely appreciate the patch's goal of staying faithful to the original concept of the game, so I thought I'd throw out some minor suggestions that wouldn't affect the game overmuch, but still make the experience a bit more pleasant:

* A 30hz strobe on Simon's sprite while he's invulnerable. All the other CV games do this, as well as most NES games in general, and its absence always felt like an oversight to me.

* The "activation area" of many of the signposts in the towns is off-center. Standing on the right half of the sign doesn't trigger it, while standing far to its left still can. This can easily trick people into thinking the sign is just decorative if they're not standing far enough to the left to read it. This would likely require level edits, but it sounds like that information is forthcoming.

* This one is pretty minor, but perhaps moving the "garlic" display to the left by 1 tile, and having the silk bag appear to its right when you obtain it, since the bag relates directly to the herbs, rather than the whip area where it's always been.

* Direct crossfade between night/day. This one has been discussed already, but it really would be an amazing effect I think, if it can be pulled off. The fade to black was always really jarring. Sprites that need to disappear could just fade to black and vanish. A bit awkward, but what's gained in atmosphere outweighs it I think.

* Finally, perhaps doing something with that unused enemy sprite (http://bmf.rustedmagick.com/cr/castlevania2.htm). It probably has no code or palette data associated with it, but having it appear somewhere even as an easter-egg would be cool.

Anyway, thanks again.

[MathUser2929]

I don't think you should add new enemies, even if you are adding one with a pre-existing sprite. Try to keep the level layout roughly the same.

[Vanya]

What would be cool is if you made Dracula Castle look more like the first level of  part 1 i think the scenery would add to the anticipation as you are making your way to Dracula's crypt

That could be accomplished with a simple palette change so it at least resembles the CV1 stage even if the graphics are a little different.
Edit: Actually the lay out of the 'crypt' is pretty close to the first room of stage 1 after the outside part. If I were going to do anything to it at all really is add 2 rooms before the 'crypt'. First I'd add a mansion front modified to look like the intro of CV1 but without the castle silhouette since it got flattened. This takes you to a ruined courtyard that then leads to the 'crypt'.

Remember as mentioned in SOTN, Dracula's castle is a creature of chaos. It may take many incarnations. The only time any level looks exactly the same is in remakes. This is a sequel, not a remake, so the level design shouldn't be the same as CV1 as dictated by the Alucard comment.

As for different money objects, you could simply use a coin. Ala CV Adventure, or the smaller coin in CV SOTN.

But also, as a direct sequel without a Dracula resurrection (the last boss is Dracula's Wraith, not a new body) the part of the castle you're seeing is the dead husk of the previous Castlevania, so it should look alike which it does save for the palette.

I don't think you should add new enemies, even if you are adding one with a pre-existing sprite. Try to keep the level layout roughly the same.

But having just one appear as an easter egg would be pure awesome. For example"

Spoiler

Perhaps put it in a very out of the way area that otherwise has no purpose.

[close]

[MathUser2929]

Putting the enemy as a easter egg would probably be ok, it won't drastically change the game.

Also, remember, Chaos is an actual being. Probably the one that changes the castle. You fight it at the end of AOS. So it would probably be around to change the castle in CV2. Besides, redesigning the level would be retconning pretty much. Retranslation isn't retconning, it's simply bringing the text closer to the japanese text.

Does it say anywhere that Dracula is the one changing the castle? Cause I thought since the Chaos comment in SOTN it's been implied that it was Chaos that was changing the castle. AOS confirmed Chaos was an actual being.

[Vanya]

The only info on the nature of the castle is that Alucard calls it a "creature of chaos" in SotN to explain to Maria (and indirectly to the player) why the castle looks completely different to the last time she was there. I don't know if that is an accurate translation of the Japanese script though. Generally speaking the term "creature of chaos" in literature means that the nature of the 'creature' is chaotic, not that it's literally a creature controlled by a being called "Chaos".

There is no evidence that the embodiment of chaos that Soma fights has any direct control of anything, not to mention that he didn't exist in the series until AoS. Actually he's little more than a plot device.

Also, let's not forget that in CoD there is an "Abandoned Castle" that is a previous version of "Dracula's Castle". Furthermore, the first stage of Bloodlines is a ruined Castlevania and that there is a new Castlevania in England at the end of the game. So it's pretty clear that not only does the castle take on new incarnations, but that it leaves it's remains behind when it appears in a new location.

Finally, it's pretty obvious that the designers of CV2 intended the "crypt" to be the ruins of the castle from 7 years previous. Adding a little more to it in a way that jives with what is already known is hardly a retcon. They don't show you exactly how that bridge connects to the shoreline of the island the castle ruins are on, but you know it's got to be there. Common sense should tell your imagination that there has to be some sort of shoreline and some distance from the bridge to the actual ruins for there to be a forest full of trees surrounding them as the background shows.

[MathUser2929]

That would be taking quite a liberty to assume the creators of CV 2 meant to recreate the layout of the CV 1 level. Also, I dunno how closely the level layout of the CV1 level in Bloodlines is, but I'm sure it had entirely new graphics, as in Dracula or Chaos rebuilt it with a similar design but with different looking material.

Been a while since I played all the way through CV II. But if the courtyard isn't exactly the same as CV 1, layout wise, then that'd mean that Simon went in a different way. That would explain the different layout.

Also note that Castlevania 1 took place in 1691 and Castlevania Bloodlines took place in 1917. There were 8 games in between it. If the CV Bloodlines level is the ruins of Castlevania then wouldn't it look like the CV 64 level as that is how it last looked before it was destroyed? How is CV Bloodlines castle supposed to be the ruins of the CV 1 level? If you are saying the CV1 castle is in a different location than the one in the games preceeding it and that the Belmonts avoided the castle until CV Bloodlines in 1917, well, that's alot of time for the Belmonts to avoid that castle. Especially since it is obviously still populated by enemies.

And if CV Bloodlines castle is the ruins of the CV 1 castle and it has almost the same layout as CV1, then that means that Simon didn't go there in CV 2, cause of the different look and layout. That or Dracula or Chaos remade the level in CV 2 to have a way different layout with different material. Then Chaos or Dracula changed it back sometime after that to have a similar layout to CV 1, but with different material. It would be kind of odd for it to redo the castle to use a similar layout to one it used before. I can't understand why Chaos or Dracula would do that. I guess it does kind of do that in SOTN, but the resemblance between CV SOTN levels and CV ROB levels is pretty small. I hear the clock tower in SOTN has a similar layout to ROB's clock tower but I'd still say they look pretty different.

Anyway, I'm against retconning the final level. At least not by a fan. Usually, re-translations are attempts at bringing the game closer to the developers original intentions. Redesigning levels isn't one of the things that does that.

If you were to redesign the level to have the same layout as CV 1, which we've already seen countless times, where do you plan on having the Dracula battle? In the Merman area? Are you sure adding pits during a Dracula battle is a good idea? Remember the Dracula battle in Dracula X for SNES. If you want to have Simon fight Dracula where the Giant bat is, I don't know if that's a good replacement either. Not sure the layout is fitting for the battle. If you want to change the layout to accomodate the battle then that goes against your wish to have the level exactly like CV1. If you plan to have a new area created to fight Dracula, then I don't see why the level couldn't be left alone in the first place as adding a new area still goes against the idea of making the level exactly like CV1. Also, if you were to create a new area to fight Dracula, how would you explain it got there if you don't believe Chaos alters the castle? Adding stairs to lead to a new area to fight Dracula would again go against the idea of having the level exactly like CV1. And if new stairs were added then you would have to explain them appearing, which would be difficult if you don't believe Chaos changes the castle. You could possibly have a item that cause a new room to appear, but that could create confusion, unless there's a clue added somewhere that is archivable. If this were done I'm sure there'd still be people that don't get the clue and thus make the game unfinishable to them. There's also the chance that people might miss the clue. Especially if it is a new clue in a new location that noone was expecting.

[Vanya]

That would be taking quite a liberty to assume the creators of CV 2 meant to recreate the layout of the CV 1 level. Also, I dunno how closely the level layout of the CV1 level in Bloodlines is, but I'm sure it had entirely new graphics, as in Dracula or Chaos rebuilt it with a similar design but with different looking material.

I have to disagree. You can lay them over each other and they fit quite nicely. Plus remember that at this point there was only CV1/VK and CV2. There was nothing to indicate they intended anything that came later. All there was was an ending where the castle crumbles and a sequel where you go back to the same castle.

Been a while since I played all the way through CV II. But if the courtyard isn't exactly the same as CV 1, layout wise, then that'd mean that Simon went in a different way. That would explain the different layout.

It's not that the courtyard is different. They bypassed it completely. The part of the castle you do get to see has the same types of tiles as in CV1, but with redrawn graphics. The palette are very similar, too.

Also note that Castlevania 1 took place in 1691 and Castlevania Bloodlines took place in 1917. There were 8 games in between it. If the CV Bloodlines level is the ruins of Castlevania then wouldn't it look like the CV 64 level as that is how it last looked before it was destroyed? How is CV Bloodlines castle supposed to be the ruins of the CV 1 level? If you are saying the CV1 castle is in a different location than the one in the games preceeding it and that the Belmonts avoided the castle until CV Bloodlines in 1917, well, that's alot of time for the Belmonts to avoid that castle. Especially since it is obviously still populated by enemies.

And if CV Bloodlines castle is the ruins of the CV 1 castle and it has almost the same layout as CV1, then that means that Simon didn't go there in CV 2, cause of the different look and layout. That or Dracula or Chaos remade the level in CV 2 to have a way different layout with different material. Then Chaos or Dracula changed it back sometime after that to have a similar layout to CV 1, but with different material. It would be kind of odd for it to redo the castle to use a similar layout to one it used before. I can't understand why Chaos or Dracula would do that. I guess it does kind of do that in SOTN, but the resemblance between CV SOTN levels and CV ROB levels is pretty small. I hear the clock tower in SOTN has a similar layout to ROB's clock tower but I'd still say they look pretty different.

I didn't mean to say that the Bloodlines ruins are the CV1 ruins. I was simply using it as an example of a game where the ruins of an incarnation of the castle leaves behind remains and a new incarnation appears in a new location.

Anyway, I'm against retconning the final level. At least not by a fan. Usually, re-translations are attempts at bringing the game closer to the developers original intentions. Redesigning levels isn't one of the things that does that.

If you were to redesign the level to have the same layout as CV 1, which we've already seen countless times, where do you plan on having the Dracula battle? In the Merman area? Are you sure adding pits during a Dracula battle is a good idea? Remember the Dracula battle in Dracula X for SNES. If you want to have Simon fight Dracula where the Giant bat is, I don't know if that's a good replacement either. Not sure the layout is fitting for the battle. If you want to change the layout to accomodate the battle then that goes against your wish to have the level exactly like CV1. If you plan to have a new area created to fight Dracula, then I don't see why the level couldn't be left alone in the first place as adding a new area still goes against the idea of making the level exactly like CV1. Also, if you were to create a new area to fight Dracula, how would you explain it got there if you don't believe Chaos alters the castle? Adding stairs to lead to a new area to fight Dracula would again go against the idea of having the level exactly like CV1. And if new stairs were added then you would have to explain them appearing, which would be difficult if you don't believe Chaos changes the castle. You could possibly have a item that cause a new room to appear, but that could create confusion, unless there's a clue added somewhere that is archivable. If this were done I'm sure there'd still be people that don't get the clue and thus make the game unfinishable to them. There's also the chance that people might miss the clue. Especially if it is a new clue in a new location that noone was expecting.

Well, I wasn't suggesting it be done at all. It's just an idea I had that I would do if I was in charge. And to be clear I didn't ever suggest a complete redesign of the layout. I only thought it might be interesting to add the parts that seem to me to be skipped. The 'crypt' would stay the same structurally. I'd just add two rooms between the abrupt cutoff from the bridge to match CV1 a little better. Maybe an illustration would be better...

Here's some reference pics:

CV1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hwhwacxpr5yhx3n/CV1%20Entrance%20Example.png

CV2
https://www.dropbox.com/s/797e6o6xhk2gdq6/CV2%20Entrance%20Example.png

And here's my idea:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kd5sz484k5wx8nc/CV2%20-%20Expansion%20Idea.png

[MathUser2929]

Is that green stuff in the Castle Ruins leaves from trees? If so that means the roof collapsed. The front wall would need to be redrawn probably to reflect that walls and ceilings are crumbling. Funny that there's no rubble even when the roof has caved in.

I don't think the main level should be redesigned, but going from that bridge to the Castle Entrance level is kind of jarring. Restoring the courtyard and entering through the front door could help the transition. I dunno about showing a cutscene of Simon looking at the faroff castle, but perhaps a wall illustrating the front gate of the Castle walls would probably make sense. I think the Castle Entrance interior should be left alone tho.

[Vanya]

Is that green stuff in the Castle Ruins leaves from trees? If so that means the roof collapsed. The front wall would need to be redrawn probably to reflect that walls and ceilings are crumbling. Funny that there's no rubble even when the roof has caved in.

Yeah. Those are trees showing over the collapsed wall. I didn't redraw everything because I had to go do some real world stuff and it's just supposed to be an example anyway.

I don't think the main level should be redesigned, but going from that bridge to the Castle Entrance level is kind of jarring. Restoring the courtyard and entering through the front door could help the transition. I dunno about showing a cutscene of Simon looking at the faroff castle, but perhaps a wall illustrating the front gate of the Castle walls would probably make sense. I think the Castle Entrance interior should be left alone tho.

Yeah, there wouldn't be a cutscene like CV1. And I'd only change the palette from purple to the original orange.

[Bisqwit]

A 30hz strobe on Simon's sprite while he's invulnerable. All the other CV games do this, as well as most NES games in general, and its absence always felt like an oversight to me.

That is a good idea. I will add it one day.

The "activation area" of many of the signposts in the towns is off-center. Standing on the right half of the sign doesn't trigger it, while standing far to its left still can. This can easily trick people into thinking the sign is just decorative if they're not standing far enough to the left to read it. This would likely require level edits, but it sounds like that information is forthcoming.

That is also very true. I will try to resize the hitbox for the signposts. Shouldn't be too difficult. I wonder though why they left it like that.

There is another signpost related bug, by the way.
When the morning comes and the zombies are vanquished, or when the night comes and the townsfolk are vanquished, the signpost responder is also vanquished along with everyone else. You can't read the sign right after sunrise / sunset, unless you scroll it out from the screen and back again. For now, I am not planning to fix it.

This one is pretty minor, but perhaps moving the "garlic" display to the left by 1 tile, and having the silk bag appear to its right when you obtain it, since the bag relates directly to the herbs, rather than the whip area where it's always been.

It would break a symmetry and the margins. Sorry.

Direct crossfade between night/day. This one has been discussed already, but it really would be an amazing effect I think, if it can be pulled off. The fade to black was always really jarring. Sprites that need to disappear could just fade to black and vanish. A bit awkward, but what's gained in atmosphere outweighs it I think.

I will still keep that in mind. Thanks for the feedback.

Finally, perhaps doing something with that unused enemy sprite (http://bmf.rustedmagick.com/cr/castlevania2.htm). It probably has no code or palette data associated with it, but having it appear somewhere even as an easter-egg would be cool.

It can only be placed in Laruba mansion (without VROM rewrites), in a town (with VROM redesign), or in the castle ruins (with VROM redesign). There appears to be palette data associated with this object (at least I can't find anything else that uses it); however, it is simply a duplicate of the fishman monster from other screens, and as such it appears like this. http://bisqwit.iki.fi/cv2fin/dev/cv2unknownmonster.png
I can't find code that activates those sprites, and thus how that monster might have behaved is up to anyone's guess. My guess is it was the related to the previous boss of Laruba's mansion before they went with Carmilla. The fact that it can be placed only in those particular scenes strictly limits its usefulness as a secret though. As a general principle, I think I'm going to leave the resurrecting of unused levels/graphics/objects to other hackers. It's a fairly common theme in hacks, and I don't think it would particularly improve Castlevania II.

Is that green stuff in the Castle Ruins leaves from trees? If so that means the roof collapsed.

Yes, the roof has collapsed, and you'd know it, if you did ever watch the ending of Castlevania 1. The green stuff looks quite similar as the green stuff in the castle's courtyard in Castlevania 1. It might be foliage or it might be slime, does not really matter in my opinion. The artistic style is a match.

[optomon]

It can only be placed in Laruba mansion (without VROM rewrites), in a town (with VROM redesign), or in the castle ruins (with VROM redesign). There appears to be palette data associated with this object (at least I can't find anything else that uses it); however, it is simply a duplicate of the fishman monster from other screens, and as such it appears like this. http://bisqwit.iki.fi/cv2fin/dev/cv2unknownmonster.png
I can't find code that activates those sprites, and thus how that monster might have behaved is up to anyone's guess. My guess is it was the related to the previous boss of Laruba's mansion before they went with Carmilla. The fact that it can be placed only in those particular scenes strictly limits its usefulness as a secret though. As a general principle, I think I'm going to leave the resurrecting of unused levels/graphics/objects to other hackers. It's a fairly common theme in hacks, and I don't think it would particularly improve Castlevania II.

Behavior code for this enemy exists. The index number for its AI is 0B, but the pointer was removed from the AI table (x41E3) for some reason. I implemented it's behavior once and it can only be placed in the Laruba mansion. Shouldn't take too long to find it again...

[Bisqwit]

Behavior code for this enemy exists. The index number for its AI is 0B, but the pointer was removed from the AI table (x41E3) for some reason. I implemented it's behavior once and it can only be placed in the Laruba mansion. Shouldn't take too long to find it again...

Yes, 0B is null. Hmm...
There are several unused AI functions.
$A558 is the best candidate probably. It is almost an exact duplicate of the AI for the flaming man found in Debious Woods; wandering around, throwing a gravity-obeying rolling fireball once in a while and turning around to do that. But there are small differences that I have not yet analyzed. It uses the flaming man's sprite (or the skeleton's, depending on the VROM page. In the mansion, it is the skeleton.)
There is also $A3BE, but that one does not move. It appears to deal with the mudman's sprites.
$A5C7 is also unused, but it's a stationary fireball that may shoot upwards under certain conditions.
$92F4 is unused, but it is something that simply devolves into Dracula's explosion.
Within the unused AI functions there was none that uses sprites 19/1A, that is the candidate for this apparition.

The object number could also have been $23, for that one is also assigned to nothing at all. That is hardly relevant though.

EDIT: Actually, I found the sprite number table... Object 14 uses sprite index 09 which refers to sprites 19/1A
So, object 14 actually produces this enemy. However, it is not likely to be the correct one, because it acts like a bunny rabbit. Bouncing like the werewolf, except with much more vigor. It is not behavior that fits this sprite. I can't find any references to object 14 in the maps, though.

[optomon]

Ahh... it is 14, not 0B sorry. I mislabled it in my notes. And that sounds like the behaviour that is associated with it.