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Author Topic: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request  (Read 7743 times)

DSwizzy145

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Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« on: June 24, 2012, 12:27:47 pm »
Hey guys, if you guys have seen my last post in the new comer topic then you'll know i'll be very intrested in translating Super Famicom japanese games if its a retranslation or a game thats looks pretty intresting. Today i've come to ask for a favor or request of translating  "Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri" in english "Jiro Akagawa's sleep of witches" for the Super Famicom please? Thank you if possible

Gideon Zhi

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2012, 12:43:54 pm »
So... what? What's your involvement in this? Are you hacking? Are you translating? What skills do you have? What skills do you feel you lack? There's no magic tool with a "translate game" button; these all involve an incredible amount of work put in by multiple individuals. If you're wanting anyone to work on a game, most likely you're going to have to put in some effort yourself.

DSwizzy145

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2012, 12:59:05 pm »
Sorry for coming off the wrong way, i apologise for that i mean't was if someone wouldn't mind helping out in like a group or something, i can help translate the japanese words like maybe just only kanji atm (if the game supports that type of language) and fix the pro nouns or puncuations or comas or grammatical errors if thats okay and if theres anyone who knows how to hack the rom so i can insert the text inside too that'll be great. again im sorry

Ryusui

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2012, 03:49:57 pm »
i can help translate the japanese words like maybe just only kanji atm (if the game supports that type of language) and fix the pro nouns or puncuations or comas or grammatical errors if thats okay

If you're trying to say "I can do the translation if someone will do the hacking," that's one thing. Here you have basically said "I don't really know how to translate Japanese and don't know how the language works at all, but I can pretend to if that'll help." As for proofreading, that doesn't happen until after the translation is done, and judging from your lack of proper capitalization and punctuation (not to mention the fact you don't know how to spell "punctuation" or "comma," or that "pronouns" is one word), I'd have to be legally insane to trust you with that job. The thing that terrifies me most of all is the implication that you believe translation is simply a mechanical one-for-one conversion from Japanese to English, which is a fine way to make an incomprehensible pile of garbage rather than a proper localization like a good fan translation should be.

Come back when you know Japanese and English well enough to make a decent contribution to such a project.

EDIT: For everyone else, best I can tell from my shambolic Wikipedia and GameFAQs investigations, "Jiro Akagawa's The Sleep of Witches" is a sound novel made with the involvement of a famous Japanese writer. Which, of course, translates to several metric assloads of text. So if it is worth a look, this is probably gonna be a huge project.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2012, 04:00:50 pm by Ryusui »
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DSwizzy145

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2012, 06:16:40 pm »
If you listen, i never said anything about i could translate any game and i never SAID it was easy i understand its very difficult to translate games but you don't have to disown people for a request and to remind you i'm still a beginner to the scene and your harassment towards me that i couldn't spell and to your misunderstanding i've was asking for help/permission to translate a game. and i know you ain't saying that my spelling and grammar and you checked other translated games with misspelled words and "try" to criticise me if not knowing how to spell certain words. if you dislike me for be being a noob and the disliking of contributing to a huge text loaded sfc game other than trying to show me around the ropes of how to get started and such then its fine by me.

Spooniest

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2012, 06:43:29 pm »
All I did was rewrite an English script. And it took six months, working by myself. Your rage and tears will avail you naught, kiddo.
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Xalphenos

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2012, 07:03:46 pm »
Ryusui wasn't really criticizing you he was simply pointing out the fact that the things you said you could bring to the table you've shown to not have an aptitude for.  All that's in the past now.  If you really want to get started go to this thread.  Or take several years to really learn Japanese.  A fan translation isn't going to start without at least a hacker and a translator on board.  And your not likely going to get either of those to help you if you can't bring anything to the table, and no cheerleading isn't a valid position.   Yes there are other positions in a fan translation but they don't matter if a hacker and translator aren't working on it. 

If you don't actually want to hack or translate than the best you can do is add the game to the request list and hope one day someone else who can will want to pick it up.

Eien Ni Hen

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2012, 07:32:43 pm »
EDIT: For everyone else, best I can tell from my shambolic Wikipedia and GameFAQs investigations, "Jiro Akagawa's The Sleep of Witches" is a sound novel made with the involvement of a famous Japanese writer. Which, of course, translates to several metric assloads of text. So if it is worth a look, this is probably gonna be a huge project.

I knew I remembered the title from somewhere! I've played this game before, and yeah, it has huge fucktons of text. The worst part is, IIRC the Japanese is more complex than the standard "A slime approaches!" RPG fare, so it would take a dedicated, experienced translator to handle this beast. :P

Also, Ryusui made a good point about translation not being a one-for-one mechanical conversion. In the case of visual novels (or really any type of Japanese prose), the whole thing has to pretty much be rewritten to make any sense in English.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2012, 07:38:43 pm by Eien Ni Hen »
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Ryusui

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2012, 08:01:43 pm »
Okay, another obstacle. The good news is that the font is uncompressed 1BPP. The bad news is that the game's kanji table has something on the order of 2,500 symbols, and I don't know yet if it uses any recognizable form of encoding.

...Yeah, I've already started looking into this. >_>

On a related note, one thing I loved about Corpse Party is noticing where the English script deviated from the literal translation of the Japanese dialogue. It brought a smile to my face to see two different exclamations of だめ!translated as "we shouldn't be here!" and "stay back!" within a minute of each other.
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DSwizzy145

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2012, 08:32:45 pm »
I understand everyone point of view and not disappointed one bit, is like i said before i've never stood out to translate this game all by myself with a few or less hackers and call it something, the point to this if some guys will be willing to contribue

Pennywise

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2012, 09:38:05 pm »
It sounds to me like you have no idea on how to even approach the project and you are asking for other people to do the work for you instead of asking for help or learning a thing or two. You need to take a step back and familiarize yourself with the various aspects of this hobby.

Ryusui is hard guy to read. First he more or less lays the brutal truth on you, then when nothing has changed, he decides to claim the project for himself. I don't think he's trying to help you because you have done nothing to merit help and doing so would be a waste of effort unless he intends to work on the project himself. Looks like you're gonna have to reevaluate some stuff.

DSwizzy145

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2012, 10:07:39 pm »
What is with you guys picking on me, your asking for proof first or something? Do you guys hate me? Im i not qualified for this sort of project? Its just one game jeez! I understand its not easy at least someone is actually intrested in this unlike u guys

Gideon Zhi

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2012, 10:14:21 pm »
I understand its not easy at least someone is actually intrested in this unlike u guys

If you're interested, then do something about it. Pick up some documents, start to learn. Experiment. Figure it out, and when you get stuck, ask specific questions. None of us are stopping you, and we've all been in your situation to some degree or other. The difference is that we all did something about it. Generally speaking we all taught ourselves, and we expect you to do the same. There's no shame in getting stuck, but you have to show that you're willing to put in the elbow grease before any of us are going to go out of our way to help you figure things out.

Ryusui

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2012, 10:34:01 pm »
I haven't "claimed" anything. It just sounded like an interesting project to look into. And while I'd be happy to provide hacking, editing, and graphics support, I have no illusions of any of that being the hard part. Translating this game will involve identifying 2,500 kanji and how they translate into hex values (again, unless the game uses an established encoding scheme), dumping a huge amount of text, translating all that text (often with little context to work with), rewriting the translation to read like the work of a bestselling author ('cause, you know, that's what Jiro Amagawa is), and inserting the finished product back into the ROM. And that's still not counting all the testing necessary to ensure the game actually runs properly afterward.

On the upside, these random probings are starting to give me back my hacking mojo. Maybe I'll actually get Death Note: The Kira Game done by the end of the year. XD (Funnily enough, the hardest part of that is probably translating all those freaking graphics...)
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DSwizzy145

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2012, 10:50:29 pm »
Thanks for the heads up and push Gideon Zhi! :) (btw i adore your work ;) very well done)  and ryisui for the intrest of looking into it . I'll get on it first thing tommorow or soon hopefully, also which script dumper do you guys recommend for the job?

Ryusui

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2012, 11:55:22 pm »
Cart before the horse, my friend. Cart before the horse.

The biggest issue you have here is that you simply do not seem to grasp the sheer amount of work involved with this undertaking. The first step in this particular project would be to figure out the game's table. For this, we need two things:

1. The game's font (DONE!)
2. The game's script (NOT DONE!)

We need to know where to freaking look for the game's text first. Finding that shouldn't be too difficult with the right tools (Protip: use Geiger's Snes9x Tracer and VSNES to figure out the printing routine, which should load the text data as well), but there's no guarantee it's not compressed, which would (a) add an additional step to the script insertion/extraction process and (b) make the usual script insertion/extraction tools useless, meaning we'd have to create custom tools for the job. The important thing at this point, however, is simply knowing where the script is located.

Rire cynlrq jvgu n pelcgbtenz? Making a table is like that, except that in this case we are looking at something on the order of 2,500 characters to figure out, and we have to complete that list before we can do anything else. That's probably the second-biggest task at hand after the actual translation/writing work.
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Eien Ni Hen

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2012, 12:31:25 am »
DSwizzy145, if you manage to find where the text is stored and get screenshots, feel free to post them in the Script Help/Language Discussion section. Myself and the other translators can help ID the bazillion 2500 characters in the game.
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Gideon Zhi

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Re: Akagawa Jirou Majotachi no Nemuri Translation request
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2012, 12:36:43 am »
Cart before the horse, my friend. Cart before the horse.

...

We need to know where to freaking look for the game's text first. Finding that shouldn't be too difficult with the right tools (Protip: use Geiger's Snes9x Tracer and VSNES to figure out the printing routine, which should load the text data as well), but there's no guarantee it's not compressed, which would (a) add an additional step to the script insertion/extraction process and (b) make the usual script insertion/extraction tools useless, meaning we'd have to create custom tools for the job. The important thing at this point, however, is simply knowing where the script is located.

Telling someone who's totally green to fire up a debugger isn't exactly a cart before horse, Ryusui :p I'd recommend starting with relative searching or some basic table theory. It's not guaranteed to turn anything up the way following code might, but it's a whole lot more beginner-friendly.