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Author Topic: Pyron  (Read 77557 times)

johnny

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #100 on: March 29, 2013, 10:32:33 pm »
I'm sure this will get done and people will love it. Then Optomon can move on to creating something new (possibly even creating kickstarters like some people do and making money if he wants). But I mean its always understandable when a project doesn 't get done or a project gets finished and someone has enough of doing anything at all as far as gaming is concerned because they just doesn't feel like doing it anymore. Interests change, people get bored, or they just find its too much of a hassle for whatever reason.

This is the reason why I stopped making midi files with soundfonts. It became too complicated especially now with HDMI Cards and such. Not to mention making a switch to Linux and the fact that people are fickle as all hell.

Its safe to say I think that Optomon and M_tee will finish Pyron but then again you never know. As I told Matrixz when he was working on Megaman Forever and getting really burned out on it, do whats best for you, not what everyone wants. And if they aren't happy with you abandoning projects and doing whats best for you then oh well that's their problem. Sure Pyron is an awesome project but also I keep in mind Optomon is doing it for fun. Once it doesn't become fun anymore and it really becomes a major annoyance, it is of course understandable for anyone to throw in the towel. Even if this doesn't get finished I still have a great amount of respect for Optomon as I did before when Cadence was around. All in all do whatever makes you guys happy and for what its worth I know I don't mean much in the rom hacking community but regardless of what happens know that you still have a supporter in me. :)

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #101 on: March 30, 2013, 02:11:52 pm »
Until the next video update comes up, I've uploaded some sketches and other spritework on my site.

A sample:
   
The redesign of the following enemy:

Not all of the stuff I uploaded is making it into the game, and there's a lot of minor sprite changes and updates and whatnot, so I didn't want to bog down the thread with them. But, check em out if you'd like.

EggBanana

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #102 on: April 01, 2013, 01:02:20 pm »
Chriiiiiiiiiiiiiiis! What is this Pyron game you have been making?

optomon

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #103 on: April 01, 2013, 03:26:48 pm »
Long story short, a Metroid like game for the Nintendo, in which you play as a guy that burns up aliens.

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #104 on: April 06, 2013, 11:04:12 am »
Boss fight for Area 1 is up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ky1_4zY0R88

Redesigned this boss a ways back. Optomon was awesome enough to re-code the boss to accommodate the new design. Below is the design process. It looks great in-game. That'll be shown soon.

Until then, the process:
Spoiler:

Initial design.


Temporary art given for coding purposes.


Some partially pixeled-on-paper sketches.

and the design:

Vanya

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #105 on: April 06, 2013, 04:04:50 pm »
Nice! That looks awesome! Reminds me of how I designed some of the sprites in an old Final Fantasy hack back in the day.

Also, the I love the design of the boss itself. It's like some twisted SMB Birdo from a live action movie I'm glad never happened. But in this context it kicks ass.

Pikachumanson

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #106 on: April 06, 2013, 04:33:50 pm »
Remind me of Kraid from Metroid. Very nice! You could do this stuff professionally M-Tee!

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #107 on: April 06, 2013, 07:32:45 pm »
Thanks. I reckon though I'm not the only guy on this board that would have no problem getting a job... if it were 1989.  :happy:

optomon

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #108 on: April 06, 2013, 10:54:54 pm »
Video playthrough with the graphical updates by M_Tee of Area 1. The second video shows the boss fight.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YyvdxCaMIk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=208QdBmfqt0

odditude

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #109 on: April 07, 2013, 11:34:29 am »
Video playthrough with the graphical updates by M_Tee of Area 1. The second video shows the boss fight.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YyvdxCaMIk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=208QdBmfqt0
Well now, that's simply amazing. To me, it has the "feel" of Blaster Master crossed with Metroid II. Impressive is an understatement!

Minor nitpick - the jetpack exhaust animation cycle seems too slow. Is it possible to speed up the animation for the jetpack exhaust, or is that sharing code with the other projectile animations?

ChronoMoogle

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #110 on: April 07, 2013, 08:35:21 pm »
Really beautiful!
I've got one thing I would like to criticise though: the player spite being always one pixel down into the ground. The player sprite looks like it's in the foreground and seems a little bit visually unconnected to the area because of that...

johnny

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #111 on: April 09, 2013, 04:43:59 pm »
I think the problem is that when walking, there are particular sprites that work with particular floor tiles for example:

Megaman 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVwsoa4bl3A

Megaman 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1RIyUJEJHs

See how in Megaman 7, Megaman's sprite is designed to walk on top of the floor tiles and in Megaman 8, his sprite blends in with the floor tiles while he walks?

While I think Pyron's new sprites are awesome, I think the floor tiles need to be changed to reflect the style of the sprite. Pyron would need to walk in the middle of a floor basically with the floor tile blending into the background as it does in Megaman 8 or certain NES games like Contra: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXcVojj2GXk which also have that walking style with floor tiles. Look at how the grass surrounds the feet in Contra. This does not happen in most early Megaman games (and Megaman 7), most Castlevania games, etc. So I would suggest redoing the floor tiles with this style. Other than that M_tee great work on the sprites but now you just need to make some floor tiles to go along with them which have more depth. :)



Just figured I'd make a picture to show what I mean. Even with the bad JPEG effect on the Castlevania 2 part you could still see my point. The Castlevania 2 tiles were made so that Simon's sprite walking on top of the blocks could fit together. Contra on the otherhand was made so that the grass can surround the feet while Bill is walking. When M_tee changed the Pyron sprite, he didn't make any floor tiles to go along with his sprite. So to me it just looks unnatural with the two different styles going together.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 05:32:11 pm by johnny »

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #112 on: April 09, 2013, 11:23:51 pm »
I think the problem is that when walking, there are particular sprites that work with particular floor tiles for example:

See how in Megaman 7, Megaman's sprite is designed to walk on top of the floor tiles and in Megaman 8, his sprite blends in with the floor tiles while he walks?

Thanks for your interest, Johnny. To assist in your explanation, the term you are look for is "overlapping," and not "blending in." The situation is explained very simply:

If the ground plane is shown, the character should overlap with the ground tile. If not, it should not. In Contra, it is shown. In Simon's Quest it is not. That is the difference between your examples. (Actually, in Megaman 7, the plane is shown, just much less than in 8. Therefore, there is still overlap, albeit much less than in 8. You can zoom in on a screenshot to see.)

Quote
When M_tee changed the Pyron sprite, he didn't make any floor tiles to go along with his sprite. So to me it just looks unnatural with the two different styles going together.

I actually produced all of the graphics in the new video with the exception of the stars in the sky at the beginning.

Spoiler:
     


Note the stronger, grid-like feel of the original. The 2-pixel overlap was less noticeable because the majority of the top row of pixels was black, resulting in the black lines dividing the ground and walls. Also, the characters feet were white, and a third of the ground was white, so there was less contrast there.

I agree that the situation is an issue, and we've both been aware of it.

The problem is that there is only one 32-pixel square used for all of the ground and walls. Moreover, Optomon assured me that re-coding the TSA to allow a separate ground plane would be a major setback at this point. One of my primary goals in the background designs is to reduce the building-block look of the original. Therefore, my design choices were made in an attempt to balance the natural pattern on the edges while minimizing the visible seams.

Perhaps I'll take another stab at it down the road, but at the moment, I'd call it a low-priority.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2013, 09:45:01 am by M_tee »

Vanya

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #113 on: April 10, 2013, 02:36:14 am »
Thanks for your interest, Johnny. To assist in your explanation, the term you are look for is "overlapping," and not "blending in." The situation is explained very simply:

If the ground plane is shown, the character should overlap with the ground tile. If not, it should not. In Contra, it is shown. In Simon's Quest it is not. That is the difference between your examples. (Actually, in Megaman 7, the plane is shown, just much less than in 8. Therefore, there is still overlap, albeit much less than in 8. You can zoom in on a screenshot to see.)

I actually produced all of the graphics in the new video with the exception of the stars in the sky at the beginning.

     


Note the stronger, grid-like feel of the original. The 2-pixel overlap was less noticeable because the majority of the top row of pixels was black, resulting in the black lines dividing the ground and walls. Also, the characters feet were white, and a third of the ground was white, so there was less contrast there.

I agree that the situation is an issue, and we've both been aware of it.

The problem is that there is only one 32-pixel square used for all of the ground and walls. Moreover, Optomon assured me that re-coding the TSA to allow a separate ground plane would be a major setback at this point. One of my primary goals in the background designs is to reduce the building-block look of the original. Therefore, my design choices were made in an attempt to balance the natural pattern on the edges while minimizing the visible seams.

Perhaps I'll take another stab at it down the road, but at the moment, I'd call it a low-priority.

Is there a technical reason the sprite's graphics can't just be shift up one pixel? I think that would be enough to greatly diminish the issue.

optomon

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #114 on: April 10, 2013, 08:54:38 am »
Much easier to just move up the player sprite.

Neil

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #115 on: April 10, 2013, 07:55:41 pm »
What is the setting for this level? It looks like a cave, but there are trees in the background.

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #116 on: April 10, 2013, 08:19:04 pm »
The game takes place in a series of underground biomes, each deeper into a planet. This is the outer-most. The planet gets more lively the closer to the core that you travel. My interpretation is that the planet thrived off of an internal heat and not necessarily from a sun. The layer shown would have been a cavernous  forest in the past, but has long been petrified.

snarfblam

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #117 on: April 10, 2013, 09:27:06 pm »
What is the setting for this level? It looks like a cave, but there are trees in the background.
Reminds me of Blaster Master

M-Tee

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #118 on: April 10, 2013, 09:41:44 pm »
The palettes in the video weren't final (The purple trees intend to be changed to increase contrast with the enemies and the yellow dinosaurs will all have brown outline as in the gifs I posted), but the next level is what would best be described as a frozen desert.

I try hard to keep everything in the game as part of telling the overall narrative, and what I'm trying to portray with the palette transitions going through the first level is:

  • Dead grey trees, dead grey grass: almost no atmosphere or moisture, full petrification.
  • Dead brown trees, weak living grass: more atmosphere, not petrified yet.
  • Light blue trees and grass: enough moisture to freeze, frost covered.

...and thus the transition into the frost desert. The sequencing doesn't exactly line up in places in the map, but I think it's enough to give the impression of the transition.

Neil

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Re: Pyron
« Reply #119 on: April 10, 2013, 09:45:07 pm »
The game takes place in a series of underground biomes, each deeper into a planet. This is the outer-most. The planet gets more lively the closer to the core that you travel. My interpretation is that the planet thrived off of an internal heat and not necessarily from a sun. The layer shown would have been a cavernous  forest in the past, but has long been petrified.

I totally don't want to sound like a dick here, but why would trees grow upwards if they're not getting closer to a sun? Damned if I know what this sort of biome would look like, but wouldn't the "plant" life be growing toward the source of heat/light/food rather than upwards toward what seems to be a colder dark cave roof? I'm probably way over thinking this, but the trees just seemed really out of place to me. I do really love the rest of the look you guys have got though.

I would suggest looking through google images of stalactites. Some of those formations almost look living, and in a world like you describe, I can picture plants pulling water from the cave ceiling and reaching out to the warmth radiating out from the floor. Just a thought.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2013, 10:00:12 pm by Neil »