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Messages - Chaos Rush

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121
Assuming that he is talking about himself,

“I’m no better than some recluse with no hopes or anything...am I?”

122
Just gonna day that I’m officially committing to making a 512kb hardware-compatible FFIII translation. Not sure if I should start a new thread for it or not when it’s ready, but at this point I kinda want people to forget about the MMC5 version so I may end up starting a new thread for it when it’s ready.

I spent a good few hours today working on the new version and I think the final result will be worth it for all. The script won’t be as fluffy as the previous version that’s based heavily off the DS version but the DS script had a lot of extra fluff anyways. The DS version had often times lines that were just “Thanks!” in the Japanese version were fluffed up into, “Thank you so much for graciously helping me with [relevant plot situation], warriors of light!” (slight exaggeration) and unfortunately a lot of that fluff is in the 1mb FF3:R. However, I think fluff in localizations is a good thing given that one has the space to do so, simply because Japanese is a high-context language where context is “read from the air”, while English is a low-context language where context must be clarified. But obviously in limited-space situations, you’d want to minimize the fluff.

With that said, this new script I’m working on is essentially a retranslation from scratch, but obviously I’m also cross-referencing the previous script for context, so it’s going pretty quickly (already about 10% done). Only information communicated in the original Japanese text will be in, and I think I’ll be able to fit it all in a 512kb ROM with my tools and DTE compression. I think I can produce something that still feels like the full complete FF3 script while maintaining hardware compatibility. Stay tuned everyone :)

123
I’ve looked over at some of the replies from the past 2 years and I think it’s safe to say that there is definitely demand for a hardware-compatible version.

Despite me saying on the previous page that I have no interest in maintaining this, I’ve come to realize that if I were to leave this behind and leave that audience hanging, it would be a dick move of me.

Rodimus Primal is free to continue on with the MMC5 version and it can be looked at as the “fully translated, definitive, non-abridged version” for people that have emulators compatible with it and want to experience something very close to the DS version in 8-bit style.

Given that at this point I’m probably the only person semi-active in the community that’s most familiar with how FFIII’s text system works, I realize that it would be wrong of me to sit back and be all “well good luck everyone, bye”. I’m going through some ideas in my head, and I think I can come up with something, but I’m not sure of the timeframe. Even though I said I’m not interested in condensing the script, maybe I can instead just do a new translation from scratch with minimalism in mind, and I would still get value from it since I get to work with Japanese text after all (I’m not interested in doing an English—>English project but I’m open to doing a new Japanese—>English project). All I’m saying is that I don’t want to leave you guys hanging.

In the mean time, I’d like to ask, for those of you that have played FFII on GBA and my FFII on NES, how did they compare? Did the FFII:R felt like it left out a lot of details or did it serve its purpose well? I’m asking because, though I don’t want to ignore Bregalad’s compression notes, I think simple DTE compression might be the way to go, but if that route is taken then you can expect the quality to be similar to FFII:R.

124
Thanks for the update Chaos Rush. I wish you the best in what you do. I can work on typo fixes as I get spare time (which right now is also something I don't have much of lately) but I am curious as to what could fix that job screen bug.

As for the typos, once I begin I'll need to compile all of the errors that have been posted to fix. If anyone has any suggestions, feel free to post them here.
If necessary, feel free to start a new thread as an addendum (similarly to your take on FFIV), or if you wish to continue the project as the same concept that it originally aimed to do then that’s fine with me too (but in that case a mod would have to transfer thread ownership). Seeing as our projects have overlapping audiences, I think you’d be a great fit for this, since the “translation/localization” part is done, you’re free to modify things as you see fit to make things tonally consistent with your FFIV & VI projects. I’ll try to stick around and can provide insight on wording/phrasing of stuff (as long as you provide the original Japanese line too, which the editor is designed as to always display it as a reference).

If you want, I can also provide my general hacking notes for FFIII, but I can’t at the moment because the laptop I have it on can’t connect to the internet where I am right now (won’t be an issue in the near future).

Feel free to take over for FFII as well lol, though that one works on hardware and for the most part I think it turned out alright given the limitations.

EDIT: Admittedly I feel a little bad that I didn’t have this as a 512kb project from the start, I simply believed that using the MMC5 mapper patch would have been the “correct” thing to do, not knowing I would alienate so many people due to mapper shenanigans of NES emulators and flashcarts and what not. I don’t want to be the one to make the 512kb version, but since I’m kinda responsible for this mess I want to help in someway so that people can play the original FFIII. I’m willing to provide a modified version of my tool for the purpose of making a 512kb version, and hopefully with that and my hacking notes, a 512kb version of an English FFIII can be made, but understand that unless someone has the ASM knowledge to massively compress text, then these compromises would have to be made:

* the script would have to be heavily abridged

* DTE compression would need to be implemented

* the in-game item menu showing the “...” for long item names wouldn’t work because I used an entirely separate text bank for those to differentiate from the main item screen from the overworld. In a 512kb ROM there would be no space to do that, meaning you’d either have to figure out how to extend the in-battle item menu, or have short item names.

If someone is up for this, I’m willing to work with them. As I said, I’m not interested in being the one to abridge the script, but I enjoy coding and ASM hacking. Let’s figure something out.

Do people just want to play the current MMC5 version but with typos fixed? Then I think Rodimus Primal can take care of that. Or is there demand for a 512kb version with an abridged script? In that case I’m willing to provide the “framework” for that (but someone else can abridge the script). Which one would you guys prefer?

(Or heck, forget Dawn of Souls, port FF1-3 to GBA and leave them in all their 8-bit glory, but have the freedom to use a VWF. Include both Japanese and English scripts. I’m sure Square Enix would get very mad if a homebrew port was ever made though lol)

125
Hello everyone, it’s been a while and I understand that the final release of this has a minor bug in the job screen that only happens when you have an odd number of jobs available, as well as some typos. I haven’t been doing much ROM hacking lately not necessarily due to lack of interest but lack of time.

There’s a couple reasons why I want to abandon this. First of all it’s completely incompatible with real hardware due to a mapper-setup combination that no Famicom/NES cartridge ever had (forgot the exact specifics, but I recall it was pointed out in this thread). I mean it works fine on emulators, but I realize the method that was used to expand the banks would have worked just fine without the mapper patch as well, and the outcome would have been the same: doesn’t work on hardware, works fine on emulators.

Secondly, the only way to get a version of this that doesn’t break any hardware rules is to simply keep the ROM the same size, thus heavily condensing the text. I have no interest in doing this whatsoever - to me the fun part of doing this was to compare the text from Japanese FFIII Famicom and English FFIII DS, but making a condensed version of the script means it’s an English-English project and I have no interest in doing that. There’s a lot more to it but I don’t want to go into too much details with personal stuff, but it has to do with my personal cultural identity that I’ve been struggling with for a while, basically I’m a half-Japanese that speaks iffy Japanese despite having lived in Japan for several years when I was little, and for the past few years I’ve been on a mission to improve it as much as possible, so doing a large English-based project has no merit for me. I’m sorry if that sounds selfish. Three years ago I wanted to play through all of the Final Fantasy games in English, but now I would rather just play through them in Japanese and experience the original works as they were written.

Also, when I did this project, my Japanese was quite bad compared to now. Luckily it’s not really a translation and more like a script-port of the official DS translation, so it worked out, and even if I redid it again I think the final result would be quite similar, but a small part of me feels like I was in no position to do this project at the time.

I know Chaos Rush has not been around since his last release and with these latest few typos grammar issues that need to be corrected, I am curious if his editor will work at fixing them. If they are, I say we should all step in to update it. Since my name is attached to it as a play tester, I don't know if I am allowed to be the one to fix it unless we can get a hold of Chaos Rush.
My editor OnionText should work. Any change that is made will recompile all the text in the game within the game’s text area to ensure that free space is used efficiently. If you’re down to it, I’ll gladly hand this project over to you to maintain typo fixes and such. But I’m not sure if this mapper combo should even be continued lol. Also not sure how to transfer thread ownership to other people.

Anyways, I’m sorry if I left you all hanging, but I just have no interest in maintaining this any further. I’m really sorry.

EDIT: one more thing I forgot to mention, some of the techniques used to achieve more screen space breaks some “guidelines” of Famicom/NES development in avoiding overscan areas. I think a real NES game would not do that, and instead find a better solution whether it be squish-tiles or abbreviations and whatnot (or port it to SNES/GBA).

126
v1.4 has been submitted to RHDN for approval! Here is the changelog:
Quote
v1.4 - July 2nd, 2017

- major bug regarding multiplying enemies fixed (credit to yasu)

- several typos fixed

Major thanks to yasu for fixing the bug regarding multiplying enemies! And thanks also to Rodimus Primal for pointing out typo's that I've also fixed in this release.

July 03, 2017, 02:33:27 am - (Auto Merged - Double Posts are not allowed before 7 days.)
I still hold that compressing script and leave the game on 512k MMC3 is the best option.
I found the mediafire like you gave me months ago, but I don't know how I should format those 10 files and attempt at compressing them with my program. In particular, I'd like to know how those / and those [xx] works exacly, and if there's an implied end marker at the end of the "messages".
Sorry for the late reply and not explaining it when I sent you those text files. The / are line breaks, and the [stuff] are name codes. Here's a (incomplete) list of them:
Spoiler:
[10][00] = Player 1's level
[10][01] = Player 1's job
[10][02] = Player 1's name
[10][03] = Player 1's head equipment
[10][04] = Player 1's body equipment
[10][05] = Player 1's arm equipment
[10][06] = Player 1's right hand equipment
[10][07] = Player 1's left hand equipment
[10][30] = Player 1's current HP
[10][31] = Player 1's total HP

[11][00] = Player 2's level
[11][01] = Player 2's job
[11][02] = Player 2's name
[11][03] = Player 2's head equipment
[11][04] = Player 2's body equipment
[11][05] = Player 2's arm equipment
[11][06] = Player 2's right hand equipment
[11][07] = Player 2's left hand equipment
[11][30] = Player 2's current HP
[11][31] = Player 2's total HP

[12][00] = Player 3's level
[12][01] = Player 3's job
[12][02] = Player 3's name
[12][03] = Player 3's head equipment
[12][04] = Player 3's body equipment
[12][05] = Player 3's arm equipment
[12][06] = Player 3's right hand equipment
[12][07] = Player 3's left hand equipment
[12][30] = Player 3's current HP
[12][31] = Player 3's total HP

[13][00] = Player 4's level
[13][01] = Player 4's job
[13][02] = Player 4's name
[13][03] = Player 4's head equipment
[13][04] = Player 4's body equipment
[13][05] = Player 4's arm equipment
[13][06] = Player 4's right hand equipment
[13][07] = Player 4's left hand equipment
[13][30] = Player 4's current HP
[13][31] = Player 4's total HP

[14][XX] = displays XX amount of spaces

The [.] are ellipses and appear in-game as a '...' squished onto a single tile. There is no end marker for the end of the messages - my tool OnionText just puts an 0x00 byte at the end of each message when compiling. Also, for dialogues that can't be displayed in a single text box (meaning that the message will scroll after four lines), there has to be a / at the end of the message or else it will display weirdly in-game by showing double (or triple or quadruple depending on how much room is shown in the text box) of the last line shown.

To get a better understanding of how the text formatting works, I recommend messing around with the translation using my OnionText tool, which has a text preview that updates as you type.

127
Hey, Chaos Rush.
I solved a multiply bug.
It was because the MMC5 patch did not handle the IRQ well.

Try patch on this link.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/spywbo4qe8gyygx/FF3MMC5-multiplybugfix.zip?dl=1

I am pleased if it will help your project ;)
Thank you so much for this!

So I guess this means I'm not going to do an MMC3 w/ illegal expanded banks after all. I'll release an updated patch hopefully within the next week or so. Again, thank you soooooo much! I was gonna redo the entire thing while keeping the original mapper (doing what the ad0220 translation did) but the only reason I was gonna do it was because of the multiply bug with the MMC5 patch.

When I have time I'll apply this patch as well as fix some typo's, and then this will finally be done once and for all :)

128
Hey everyone, I'm sorry to have left you all hanging. I'm still busy but I should have more time this summer. Here is my plan:

Make a version that keeps the MMC3 mapper, just like the ad0220 patch. Unfortunately I can't fix the multiplying issue because I simply don't have the ASM knowledge to do so. Redoing the whole thing while keeping the original mapper will work on any emulators that the ad0220 patch works on. Honestly it shouldn't take me that long, since I still have all the notes I wrote down for things like menu box sizes and positions and such. It would probably take me less than a week to finish (but don't quote me on that). The text will be exactly the same as the MMC5 version that I have out now.

In order to make a version that works on hardware however, there's just no way around it but it would require significantly condensing the text so that it all fits on a 512kb ROM (or however small vanilla FFIII is, I forgot lol). I'm sorry to say that I have no interest in doing this, but I will gladly provide my FFIII notes and tools for anyone that wishes to abridge the script to fit on a non-expanded ROM so they can replicate things like expanding the menu box sizes and such.

Once this is finally done and out of the way though, I won't be working on any more translations, as I have lost interest in playing text-heavy games in English. The reason why is, as I might have mentioned before, Japanese was technically my first language, but having lived in the US since I was six years old, I forgot a lot of Japanese as I've spent most of my life in an English-speaking environment. One of the reasons why I wanted to provide better English translations for FFII and FFIII is so that I could "get better" at Japanese by analyzing all the text, but over the past year I've recovered a lot of Japanese vocabulary just by regularly talking with exchange students, and I figured by this point I might as well just play games in Japanese (also I want to make up for lost time - my first video game (Pokémon Green for the Game Boy) was in Japanese, but after my family moved to America the rest of the games I played in English, which I regret a lot).

So basically, I'm not dead, and I haven't forgotten about this. I won't leave y'all hanging - but once I'm done with the MMC3 version I probably won't be around much. But I hope people are enjoying my FFII and FFIII patches and can be patient for the MMC3 version that hopefully can be played all the way through without any glitches!

129
I'm actually thinking of making a version that uses oversized MMC3, which is what the ad0220 translation did. It wouldn't work on hardware of course.

130
Personal Projects / Re: Final Fantasy II: Refurbished
« on: January 11, 2017, 02:02:20 pm »
Is anyone else experience a glitch where max HP resets to 0? It has happened several times to me. It seems to happen when my max HP goes above 255. This is a game-breaking glitch and a shame because this translation is so well done otherwise. Any help is appreciated!
Which version number do you have in the readme file that was provided with the patch? That glitch should have been fixed in the latest version.

131
Hi everyone, I apologize for disappearing for months and not being able to take care of the bug. I've been quite busy with college and I honestly don't know when I'll have time to take care of it, as school is my number one priority. Regardless of that, I will look into it soon, I'm just not sure when. (Also Kea if you find the fix be sure to PM me so I can get it in the next version).

132
v1.3 has been submitted to RHDN for approval. It fixes all of the issues pointed out by Rodimus Primal a couple posts above, in addition to a few others typo's. It also provides an extra optional patch that fixes the Item Upgrade bug (thanks to Kea for the fix).

The changelog is as follows:
Spoiler:
- several typos fixed

- several text overflow errors fixed

- optional Item Upgrade Bug fix patch added. This patch is optional
 due to the fact that this is fixing a bug that is present in the
 original Japanese version of the game, and some people might want
 to keep the bug for their own purposes.

Forgot to mention this in the changelog, but yes, I also took Rodimus's text suggestions too, so Desch doesn't say "magicks" anymore.

133
@Rodimus Primal: Thanks for these, I think this is enough to warrant an update. I'll try and roll it out as soon as I have time :)

A side note, what Desch is saying about "I'm not attuned to the magicks enough to use it" is exactly what he says in FF3DS. As for the second screenshot I don't remember if it's exactly what the DS version said so I'll take your suggestion for it and add you to the credits (I'll probably change the "magicks" line too since that is weird-sounding, but it IS also what he says in the DS remake).

134
@Chaos Rush

These. Are there gonna be any more updates like these? You mentioned something of a v1.3 of this translation way above.
Yeah, but I'm gonna wait a bit to see if any more typo's are found since I don't think I should pull out an update just to fix two typo's (that were found since v1.2). Either way I'll push out another update within a month or so regardless of whether or not any more typo's are found.

135
@Rodimus Primal: I might look into it at some point, though I think it would be a bit unfair if some items got to use squish tiles while other items still have to use abbreviations due to limited tile VRAM space.

Are there any more updates for this translation, or is everything (almost?) done here?
It's been done for a month now, and can be downloaded from RHDN (link to page in my signature). The only updates are to correct any typo's found.

136
Interesting. Just have to live with it then.

I found a text overflow after beating Medusa.


Thanks for pointing this out, it'll be fixed in v1.3.

137
Finally got around to polishing up my text editing tool to a somewhat presentable state. My FFIII text editor, OnionText, has been submitted to the RHDN Utilities database, but in case it doesn't get approved for whatever reason, you can download it here: https://www.mediafire.com/?qtbk4p9co4c6940

The translated English script and the original Japanese script of Final Fantasy III is provided with the tool.

Oh sorry, I tought you were done already. Just please don't forget to give me the script once it's finish :) Compressing it is extremely simple but hacking the game to handle a compressed script can effectively be though I guess - especially with a packed fixed PRG-ROM bank.
The script has been done for a while (as well as the patch), I just haven't gotten around to polishing up my tool to a state where other people besides me can make sense of it. I've released the tool now though (link above), and I've also provided both the translated English script and the original Japanese script with it.

Something I've noticed and I don't remember if it was in previous translations or the original Japanese ROM is that items do not stay sorted. I moved a Potion to the first slot on the item list, exited the item menu, returned only to have my item list exactly the way it was before! I'm not sure if its a glitch or not.
May I ask what emulator you are using? I am not encountering that issue on FCEUX 2.2.2. Can you also verify whether that happens for you just by using Kea's MMC5 patch alone?

138
So now that this is finished, have you considered compressing the script and see if it'd fit a geniune MMC3 ?

I looked into compressing the graphics, too. With FF1 that'd be easy but the problem is that with FF3 uses a very advanced system for its graphics, every metatile is loaded separatedly and every character is loaded separatedly for sprites. In battle, each monster is loaded individually, and the party's sprites are loaded dynamically as action goes on. This makes graphic compression very difficult for the most part. The ultra-crowded fixed PRG bank doesn't help either.

I'd still be curious to see what is possible to do with text compression.
I just don't have the time; I go back to school in a couple weeks. I'm still working on fine-tuning my text editor for user-friendliness (and I barely have the time for that since my work schedule suddenly got really crazy these past couple weeks), and as I said on the previous page, I'll provide the English and Japanese scripts with the editor, you guys do whatever you want with it.

139
Point of advice when you submit new files since it's what I do. I use my dropbox Public folder when I submit an update. Since it takes a bit for approval, it actually gave me time to fix a small error found before the update was approved since all I had to do was copy over the file in my dropbox. Once approved you can always delete it and upload the update to mediafire if that's where you want it hosted.
Thanks, I'll consider that for the future. Problem with Dropbox is that I had to remove it from my computer because it was causing some problems with the start menu on Windows 10, so hopefully they'll fix that eventually.

I'm going to guess that it wouldn't be as simple as just moving the icons to some of those unused "box" tiles in the font because of the way the game's item sorting routine is coded.  That really only leaves more descriptive names, which will involve ugly abbreviations, or just dealing with having to check the item list to see which of three possible "Leather" you just found, I guess.

Ah well.  You've done well already. :)
I think it would actually work if I did that, since those particular 'box' tiles are just blank unused tiles that happen to be loaded into the RAM while you're in-battle and in the overworld. But I left some blank tiles so that if anyone wants to translate my patch into their language, then they have some extra tiles to work with in case they want more character sets or squish tiles. But we'll see, this is something I'll think about for v1.3.


Will you include the fix to the item upgrade glitch for 1.3?
Ah, I forgot about that, sorry. It will be in v1.3 but as a separate patch.

I think I'll wait a couple weeks for v1.3, hopefully more typo's are reported by then (although I'd be equally glad if there aren't any more, lol).

This screenshot is actually an early version of FFII on the Wonderswan, that's Altair with beta tiles.

140
v1.2 has been submitted for approval to RHDN, but if you want it early, get it here: https://www.mediafire.com/?alu8bphus4641yp

Here's the changelog:
Spoiler:
v1.2 - August 25th, 2016

- glitch fixed that involves messages not displaying correctly when
 using a status-healing item in-battle

- healing items now have the bottle icon from FFII Prototype in order
 to maintain consistency with FFII:Refurbished.
 (In the original Japanese versions of both FFII and FFIII, these
 items had no icon)

Screenshot of aforementioned fix:


Is it possible to tweak the name pointer in the message to use the icon?  Obviously Japanese didn't need it because the item name was sufficiently descriptive, but given our space limitations in English, might be a worthwhile change if it can be done.
Unfortunately it's not that simple. The item icons aren't even loaded into the RAM when you're in the overworld (except the boomerang, shuriken, and magic icons):

On the left is what's loaded into the PPU when you're in the overworld, while on the right is what's loaded into the PPU when you're in-battle.

However, as of v1.2, a side-effect of me adding the new Potion icon (FF3 didn't have one originally) to match FFII:R, the Potion icon now shoes up in the overworld because the table ID I chose to represent that tile IS loaded into the RAM when you're in the overworld... but that game treats it as a normal letter because that icon wasn't in the Japanese version.

EDIT:
That would be helpful if it could be done.

I found a typo as seen below. It's when you talk to the king in Castle Sasune.It should be skeleton key.

 
Dammit of course another typo is found after I already submitted v1.2.... Looks like this typo fix will have to wait until v1.3, lol. But thanks for playing this!

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