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Author Topic: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)  (Read 44173 times)

DannyPlaysSomeGames

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #60 on: October 16, 2020, 03:05:32 pm »
I might be too late, but I made a hi-res font based on the one from my hack as a suggestion for a different font (the middle one is the original for comparison, other two are how it looks in black and white).


And here it is in action:


I just thought it would look neat and fit in with the aesthetic of the game.
Hey there

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #61 on: October 16, 2020, 03:33:53 pm »
@Aclectico, I see what the problem is now.

Let me ask, is it possible to have Mesen insert a new 8x8 tile if the base 8x8 tile in the game changes?
For example, if Link moves to a new area, and the 8x8 tile in Automap changes to add a new 4x4 one, could you code something in Mesen so the 8x8 tile that is currently in use gets updated to a new 8x8 tile that has the added map location? Basically replacing 8x8 tiles for each possible combination. I'm not sure if this can be done.

Since Mesen graphic replacement is based on 8x8 tiles, I'm not aware of a way this can be done with the emulator. In addition, Sour (the author of Mesen) has indicated that he is taking a break from development - possibly indefinitely. As a result, I'm not sure I would count on any changes to the emulator graphic replacement functionality from here on out without a fork.

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If not, then the only other option I can think of is making it so that whenever you walk into a new location in the Map, you uncover the whole 8x8 section of that area. It's a small countermeasure, but you could at least still implement it with new 8x8 tiles with that small con.

If the .ips file is changed so that 8x8 areas are revealed all at once, that would probably work. However, the various graphic glitches I mentioned earlier would need to find some other alternate fix via substitution. Currently, a lot of bugs are fixed by a grey map box being present in the upper left hand corner of the screen. If an automap was used instead of that big grey box with the 8x8 method instead of the 4x4 method - the starting 8x8 square could possibly be used instead of the grey box as long as it is always there in the overworld and as long as it never changes.

I might be too late, but I made a hi-res font based on the one from my hack as a suggestion for a different font (the middle one is the original for comparison, other two are how it looks in black and white).


And here it is in action:


I just thought it would look neat and fit in with the aesthetic of the game.

Looks interesting and I'm still open to getting more feedback.

AdamDravian

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #62 on: October 16, 2020, 11:22:29 pm »
The first one is clearly the best.

The problem with fancier fonts is that it goes against type. Seems like a good idea since the medieval fantasy component and "ye ole fonts" seem to go hand in hand. But in reality, it makes for a cheap cheesy looking product. I start to feel like I'm playing a Monty Python version of Zelda, and I'm sure you are not wanting that, amirite?

Fonts like the first one are cleaner and more neutral. It would be cool for a font even cleaner than that since it is a touch space aged. But the others really ruin the game.

In fact, the original Zelda font is just fine as it is. Maybe you can pass it through an xBRz filter to smooth the edges a bit. But If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Sometimes little touches go a long way and you don't want to telegraph that this is a hack too much. For me, when you play a hack, it is what you don't notice that makes these things work. A fancy font simply just doesn't ring natural and you want to make this as organic an experience for the user since you are already radically changing SO much. My 2cents.

I agree with Pleiades. The more stylized the font is, the more polarizing it will be. It's best to go with something basic and neutral, like the first option.
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kya

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #63 on: October 17, 2020, 04:25:55 am »
I also have to agree, that less style == wider acceptance, but could the font at least be serif?
Let it be plain, non-fancy, but still serif. For me, a sans serif font (as in example 1) always has some futuristic look, better suited to sci-fi games, like Metroid. And serif fonts better suit fantasy themed games.

Maybe you could try the font in the following Dwarf Fortress assets thread?

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=158009.0

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #64 on: October 17, 2020, 08:53:36 am »
I also have to agree, that less style == wider acceptance, but could the font at least be serif?
Let it be plain, non-fancy, but still serif. For me, a sans serif font (as in example 1) always has some futuristic look, better suited to sci-fi games, like Metroid. And serif fonts better suit fantasy themed games.

Maybe you could try the font in the following Dwarf Fortress assets thread?

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=158009.0

Makes sense to me. I like the first one, but I agree that it strikes me as a bit too futuristic. Let's try this one. It's a slightly modified version of Hylia Serif found here (I can also try a mockup of the Dwarf Fortress font a bit later): https://zeldauniverse.net/media/fonts/

I altered the accents at the ends of the letters a bit so they are a little less prominent and filled in hollow portions in some of the letters. Maybe it will be a little less controversial??
« Last Edit: October 17, 2020, 09:37:06 am by Aclectico »

AdamDravian

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #65 on: October 17, 2020, 09:26:42 am »
 :thumbsup:
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kya

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #66 on: October 17, 2020, 10:32:30 am »
I like this. I think the font fits. Now a "CHOOSE A FILE" screen needs some treatment. There's no demand for a monospace font there, so maybe the title screen font will do?

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #67 on: October 17, 2020, 10:47:31 am »
I like this. I think the font fits. Now a "CHOOSE A FILE" screen needs some treatment. There's no demand for a monospace font there, so maybe the title screen font will do?

Correct, the "CHOOSE A FILE" text does not have the same constraints on the top and bottom. However, the text used to indicate the player name still has the spacing constraints. I suspect it may look best if the entire screen is all one font. I'm thinking "CHOOSE A FILE," "NAME," "LIFE," "REGISTER YOUR NAME," and "ELIMINATION MODE" would all share the Hylia font. The only exception is that they would have red letters and the outline accents. I may be able to create a mockup later today or tomorrow.

jrbless

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #68 on: October 17, 2020, 11:29:30 am »
I'm liking the updated graphics, but have a very minor enhancement request.  In the dungeons, it gives a hint for breakable tiles.  However, in the overworld it does not have a hint for bombable walls or burnable bushes.  Is that something which could be added?

Sam Atoms

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #69 on: October 17, 2020, 04:47:16 pm »
Is there a way you could get something like the Diablo font in there?



That could seriously rock.

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #70 on: October 17, 2020, 08:45:48 pm »
I'm liking the updated graphics, but have a very minor enhancement request.  In the dungeons, it gives a hint for breakable tiles.  However, in the overworld it does not have a hint for bombable walls or burnable bushes.  Is that something which could be added?

Did you find an Overworld breakable rock area without a hint? They should be there (one limitation, is that the breakable rocks in the Overworld share hints with quest 1 and quest 2). So, it's possible to come across a cracked rock that can't be bombed. But, there isn't intended to be any rocks that can be bombed that don't have a hint. Let me know if you find a rock that can be bombed that doesn't have a hint.

As far as shrubs go, some hints are in the works for screens that have burnable shrubs. However, the hint may not be what most players would expect.

Is there a way you could get something like the Diablo font in there?



That could seriously rock.

Maybe, I'll have to give it some thought. While the lettering is nice, at this time I'm leaning a bit more toward the Hylian font as that reminds me a bit more of something that is Zelda-esque.

**Edit**
I have some drafts of the game select screens with the new Hylian font:


« Last Edit: October 18, 2020, 12:15:04 am by Aclectico »

kya

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #71 on: October 18, 2020, 06:46:55 am »
Nice!

Jertigo

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #72 on: October 18, 2020, 09:11:58 pm »
I took all the suggestions into consideration and made a brand new font. The base font is called Mangosteen, but I redrew each character to perfectly fit within the 16x16 restriction. It is a square like font with serifs and avoids circular shapes, which do not generally look good without antialiasing. Check it out!


guppy

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #73 on: October 19, 2020, 07:55:02 am »
I just gave this a try.  Overall I think it is great. Very nice work!


I am very impressed with the new overworld tiles. I was disappointed that Link no longer has an ascending/descending animation when entering/exiting cave entrances, but from reading the previous thread this has been discussed and it doesn't seem like much can be done.

My main issue with the new graphics is that Link looks smaller than he is.  What I mean is that it feels like his hitbox is too big for his sprite.  I keep getting hurt by running into enemies when it feels like I should have a few more pixels of space before I come into contact with them. I think the original Link sprite took up more space within his tile, and thus gave an impression that he was a little more squat and bulky, and I could tell when I was close to touching an enemy, but here I feel like I should have another step or two before I take damage, and it keeps surprising me.

I think a lot of the monster sprites could be better, as well.  I'm not crazy about the way the moblins and goriyas look.  It's hit and miss -- so far it seems like the creepy-crawly enemies are good, but I don't care for most of the humanoids.  Octorocks, leevers, tektites, kees = good to great; Link, moblin, goriya, stalfos = needs work.

It's hard to remember, but doesn't the underworld map have a way to indicate to the player which rooms they have physically visited?  It seems that this is missing from the HD remake.

I like [select] to cycle my B-item, and the increase of bombs capacity.

If you intend to keep working on this, it will be interesting to see how much more you can do with it.

Thank you for making it!

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #74 on: October 19, 2020, 11:36:18 am »
I took all the suggestions into consideration and made a brand new font. The base font is called Mangosteen, but I redrew each character to perfectly fit within the 16x16 restriction. It is a square like font with serifs and avoids circular shapes, which do not generally look good without antialiasing. Check it out!



Bummer! I just finished spending a few hours revising the pack with the new Hylian font and it's pretty much complete. I do like this one though. I'm not sure if I want to go back and re-do the work ... maybe.

I just gave this a try.  Overall I think it is great. Very nice work!

My main issue with the new graphics is that Link looks smaller than he is.  What I mean is that it feels like his hitbox is too big for his sprite.  I keep getting hurt by running into enemies when it feels like I should have a few more pixels of space before I come into contact with them. I think the original Link sprite took up more space within his tile, and thus gave an impression that he was a little more squat and bulky, and I could tell when I was close to touching an enemy, but here I feel like I should have another step or two before I take damage, and it keeps surprising me.

Here's a comparison of the new graphics compared to the old. In short, it depends on which direction you are facing.



If you look on the far right, the new graphics are actually slightly larger than the old in terms of horizontal size. The middle is about a half pixel smaller on each side.

The picture on the left is about 1 pixel shorter in the rear and about a half pixel in front. Making a perfect 1x1 replacement graphic is possible. However, it starts to look funny because Link is so extremely short and stocky in the original graphics. The small tradeoff in hitbox seemed worth the aesthetic improvement of proportions that are pretty crazy. In addition, the sprite needed to be made just a little smaller than the source material from Cadence of Hyrule to make room for Link to bounce around.

Also, below is a clip of an enemy hitting Link with the old and new graphics.




The original game looks to be pretty forgiving with collision detection. I suppose you could say this pack may be just a hair less forgiving on that front in terms of how Link fits in the hitbox.

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I think a lot of the monster sprites could be better, as well.  I'm not crazy about the way the moblins and goriyas look.  It's hit and miss -- so far it seems like the creepy-crawly enemies are good, but I don't care for most of the humanoids.  Octorocks, leevers, tektites, kees = good to great; Link, moblin, goriya, stalfos = needs work.

Thanks for the feedback.

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It's hard to remember, but doesn't the underworld map have a way to indicate to the player which rooms they have physically visited?  It seems that this is missing from the HD remake.

If you press start and visit the inventory screen, you will see the map that I think you are remembering.

« Last Edit: October 19, 2020, 01:41:31 pm by Aclectico »

Jertigo

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #75 on: October 19, 2020, 11:57:27 am »
In case you change your mind, here is the full font set:


FeRcHuLeS

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #76 on: October 20, 2020, 12:12:49 am »
What a cool project it is!!!, and it is compatible with Retroachievements and Retroarch at least ForLowCPUs version for me, the other version don't work at all using an updated core, I've got an issue maybe is related to the core compatibility maybe not. The HUD map disappears by accesing the menu in dungeons so can't compare the map progress, I've got a map of course.

Two suggestions:
1° Refered to "breakable tile hints". It is hard to see the cracks can they be more more visible, I'm playing at scaled resolution to 720p since is 3x times the native resolution of the NES.

2° The color scheme of the dungeons are a bit dark.

It plays fantastic by the way what are the minimun specs? for the version including fog and water animation, I hope 32bit system is enough.

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #77 on: October 20, 2020, 11:37:31 am »
In case you change your mind, here is the full font set:



Thanks - I'll keep this on hand for future reference.

What a cool project it is!!!, and it is compatible with Retroachievements and Retroarch at least ForLowCPUs version for me, the other version don't work at all using an updated core, I've got an issue maybe is related to the core compatibility maybe not. The HUD map disappears by accesing the menu in dungeons so can't compare the map progress, I've got a map of course.

Two suggestions:
1° Refered to "breakable tile hints". It is hard to see the cracks can they be more more visible, I'm playing at scaled resolution to 720p since is 3x times the native resolution of the NES.

2° The color scheme of the dungeons are a bit dark.

It plays fantastic by the way what are the minimun specs? for the version including fog and water animation, I hope 32bit system is enough.

1. I'm reluctant to make the "breakable tile hints" more visible. The thought was to make something for players to reference if they were looking closely - but not too "in your face." Do others wish the tiles were more obvious?

2. The dungeon color scheme was actually referenced from BS Legend of Zelda. Do others feel they are too dark as well?

3. As far as minimum specs go, I'm not sure. I haven't tested it on many computers. What I can say is that one of the major CPUs used for testing was an i7-7700HQ. With this processor, everything seems to run smoothly unless there are a lot of other windows or programs running in the background.


**Also, verison 1.1 is now available for download. A changelog is available below**

-Version 1.1
   -Changed gameplay font to a modified version of Hylia Serif (original source files available here: https://zeldauniverse.net/media/fonts/).
   -Minor changes to the Overworld.
   -Added new music to the "ZeldaHDAlternateMusic" folder.

New download links are available at the start of the forum thread.


Pee wee

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #78 on: October 20, 2020, 01:55:36 pm »
Hi friends,

I don’t know what to say!! Thanks so much for Zelda Remastered.

I am a new member and I would hope forward to learn from each one of you. Pls, not work with Mesen v0.9.9 (standalone), however, work with the retroarch core. Why?

THANKS IN ADVANCE.

Aclectico

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Re: Zelda: Remastered (Mesen HD Pack)
« Reply #79 on: October 20, 2020, 02:09:56 pm »
Pls, not work with Mesen v0.9.9 (standalone), however, work with the retroarch core. Why?

Not sure - Somehow the Retroarch core must have been updated recently by someone to accept the latest functionality (mainly, multi-layer backgrounds). Last I checked, the same was not true of the standalone version. But, I must admit that I haven't tested it in the past couple of days. So, it's possible that the standalone version was quietly updated as well.