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Author Topic: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left  (Read 3252 times)

RHDNBot

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ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« on: May 19, 2020, 06:29:33 pm »

Update By: C-Dude

When a player considers alternate narratives for Final Fantasy 3 (SNES), the mind naturally gravitates to the powerful imperial general cut down too soon.  Leo Cristophe.

Hackers are aware of this.  Indeed, many dig into the heart of this game trying to give Leo a more significant role.  But when others go right, does not curiosity and a contrarian spirit drive you to go left?

Who would ever give Banon a second thought?  He's gruff, the player is forced to protect him lest a game-over be inflicted, and as rebel leaders go he's a bit doughy.  The game itself even writes him off, leaving the player to decide his fate when things are at their worst.  He is an unresolved thread, a loose end.

So instead of turning right, this hack goes left.  Who knows what waits to be found in the rough crags of this path?  Will the gamble be worthwhile, or will it succumb to the elements on the cold moor?  You decide.

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Josephine Lithius

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2020, 09:02:05 pm »
I like the idea of this hack.  It kind of makes me want to look into hacking this game and giving Biggs and Wedge more of a role, too.  I really do think they should've been recurring characters, like Solt and Peppor from Chrono Cross.  Maybe that's just me, though…

Anyway, I might have to give this a whirl.  It'd give me a good excuse to replay the game.  Again.

Meeph

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2020, 10:30:31 pm »
 :thumbsup:
-- Meephkins

jimstrom

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2020, 06:12:22 am »
Well we technically never see them die, just vanishing, would be interesting if they featured in imperial centric scenes, like:

The burning of Figaro Castle
The Siege of Doma
The Aassault on Narshe
In the Pub at Albrook
at the Banquet in Vector
in Thamasa
And a last Cameo in World of Ruin, maybe working in the Colosseum instead of the generic soldier who is normally there.

PowerPanda

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2020, 09:42:09 am »
I like the idea of this hack.  It kind of makes me want to look into hacking this game and giving Biggs and Wedge more of a role, too.  I really do think they should've been recurring characters, like Solt and Peppor from Chrono Cross.  Maybe that's just me, though…

Anyway, I might have to give this a whirl.  It'd give me a good excuse to replay the game.  Again.

Head on over to ff6hacking.com. C-Dude and I worked together to put out a "full roster" hack that allows the character to permanently add a 15th and 16th party member to their roster. He "went Left" with this idea, and I am "going right". I have been working on a mod that does what this news story calls out: making Leo survive. In the process, I'm giving Banon an expanded role, and giving... closure... to his story. In other words, Banon travels to Thamasa as an ambassador to the Espers, and Kefka double-crosses him. Leo, in disgust at the Emperor's complicity in the treachery, joins your team. I have restructured events in the World of Ruin to give him a story arc and character development. I'm a couple of weeks away from releasing a version 0.8, which is playable from start to finish, but doesn't have all of the new World of Ruin content yet.

C-Dude

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2020, 12:42:12 pm »
He "went Left" with this idea, and I am "going right". I have been working on a mod that does what this news story calls out: making Leo survive.
Nah, I wasn't calling you out.  Your work inspired mine, after all, and your hack will definitely be superior.  I was only drawing attention to my absurdity in picking Banon as a permanent party addition, because in the vanilla game he's only usable for one auto-scrolling sequence and he's a liability there.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2020, 05:03:11 pm by C-Dude »

jimstrom

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2020, 03:06:04 pm »
That sounds really cool, i always preferred the more storydriven world of balance, and thought the world of ruin mostly was a series of sidequests, so any attempt to expand the story in world of ruin is welcome in my book.

Swordmaster

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2020, 03:27:12 pm »
That sounds really cool, i always preferred the more storydriven world of balance, and thought the world of ruin mostly was a series of sidequests, so any attempt to expand the story in world of ruin is welcome in my book.

I agree with this 100%.

PowerPanda

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2020, 08:25:49 pm »
Your work inspired mine, after all, and your hack will definitely be superior.

We don't know that. You've released your hack. I haven't released mine. But part of our little community means celebrating each others' accomplishments. Today, the celebration is yours.

That sounds really cool, i always preferred the more storydriven world of balance, and thought the world of ruin mostly was a series of sidequests, so any attempt to expand the story in world of ruin is welcome in my book.

The problem is the way the game is structured. In order to do story scenes well, you either need to have super-generic lines or forced party members. Forcing party members in the World of Ruin is very challenging, as there are so many ways for the player to get around it. You basically have to create a gate at the entrance to a location so it won't let you in unless you have a certain party configuration. or completely restructure the way the game handles parties. It's rough.

C-Dude

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2020, 08:54:34 pm »
Forcing party members in the World of Ruin is very challenging, as there are so many ways for the player to get around it. You basically have to create a gate at the entrance to a location so it won't let you in unless you have a certain party configuration. or completely restructure the way the game handles parties. It's rough.
Exactly.  I went about it by drawing out the content between the lonely isle and the Falcon, which allowed me to land-lock specific parties around the World of Ruin and tailor events to them.  Once the airship is in play, it's basically a free-for-all because the player has full control of party structure and destination.

To achieve this, I also had to park the airship on an unused locale (Triangle Island), because once a party change occurs in the World of Ruin, the game assumes you should have the airship and plops it in front of Kefka's tower by default.

And in the spot where I needed Locke in the party, I threw a locked door in the way, hehehe.

LivingfortheNight

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2020, 12:26:20 pm »
wonderful writing

Josephine Lithius

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2020, 03:43:29 am »
Uh.  I feel like I may have indirectly started something I didn't intend to, in this thread, and taken focus away from the point of the news update.  Though, I do like the idea of having all of the named, "incidental" characters survive until this very end, in addition to Leo or Bannon.

Still, I apologize for kind of derailing the spotlighted hack.  That really wasn't my intention.  ):

PowerPanda

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2020, 06:09:10 pm »
Still, I apologize for kind of derailing the spotlighted hack.  That really wasn't my intention.  ):

It's actually not a big derailment. C-Dude (the author of this hack) and I worked together on the Full Roster hack, and it's the backbone of both of our hacks. We made it for ourselves, but also so that people like you could realize their dream of playable characters like Biggs/Wedge. :beer:

C-Dude

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2020, 08:32:16 pm »
You give me too much credit, PowerPanda, all I did was insert a bypass into the shop routine so that we could use sprites other than Merchant and Imp.  User "Myself086" wrote the Gogo scrolling code and you straightened out all the other details to expand Hatzen08's Guest Adder.

ReCast doesn't use FullRoster in its entirety, though, I was too far in development before it was finished.  Instead, Strago got moved to Gogo's actor slot and Banon took actor slot 7.  In fact, in an earlier build Strago didn't have magic at all: he was using party magic until I found GrayShadows' work on Gogo from the 15th man project.

All that said, I hope FullRoster will have a fruitful life in the FF3 hacking community.  I'm secretly crossing my fingers that Iris Havengard will get another shot. I'm also hoping the randomizers will adopt it, since two extra actor slots would open a lot of possibilities.

Getting back to the discussion of incidental characters, I do have some fun with Biggs, though fun is a relative term.  I don't want to spoil too much, though... let's just say the banquet is more interesting for his presence.  Another incidental character who gets an extra nod in ReCast is the surviving Doma Sentry.  Were I more ambitious I suppose I could have done more with him; his use here was convenience of continuity.

Alby4t5

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2020, 10:01:44 pm »
I've been enjoying this hack very much. I seem to have an issue however. After I completed the banquet in Vector, the game seems to just get hung up and... nothing happens after and I'm unable to move. I've never had this happen the vanilla FF3/6, so I'm curious if this is possibly a bug in the hack itself. :x

C-Dude

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2020, 10:04:13 am »
After I completed the banquet in Vector, the game seems to just get hung up and... nothing happens after and I'm unable to move.
Definitely sounds like a bug, and a serious one if it's locking the game.

May I ask some questions?  You can help me find and quash it.
* Who did you take to the banquet?
* Where did the banquet freeze up?  Was it after the first fade-out, when the party is normally supposed to gather, or after the second fade-out when you're usually supposed to regain control?

EDIT: I've found the source of the bug, and it will be repaired in version 1.02 once that is available for download.  I improperly initialized the actor you recruited in the cliffs of Narshe.  Since he was not in your party, his object didn't exist, and the event script was waiting for him to complete an animation he could not because he was not on screen.  I moved up the initialization in the event code and tested it, and now this lock does not occur.  Thank you for finding it and apologies that it hung up on you; any save prior to the banquet will work, and any savestate during the banquet proper should also work.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2020, 11:05:42 am by C-Dude »

jimstrom

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2020, 12:18:48 pm »
Yeah i wondered what  happened to that soldier, the same with Impressario who is also gone in world of ruin. Also is there an ingame explanation why Narshe is abandoned in world of ruin?

Edenlegaia

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #17 on: May 24, 2020, 09:32:15 am »
Eurgh.....i've tried to play this, but right as the first soldiers in Narshe rushed on me, the screen just faded to black and.....nothing else. I couldn't even fight a single time.
I was playing on my Raspberry 3, Recalbox.

Pluggy

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #18 on: May 24, 2020, 11:28:56 pm »
First off this is a great hack, the changes the author did in the first part of the game did make the story more detailed from the original, I can't wait to reach the WoR to see the massive changes compared to the base game.

Now I'm not sure if this is because of bad luck or something else but I can't make the magicite ZoneSeeker to appear in the auction house after two hours ingame. Maybe I should keep trying?

C-Dude

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Re: ROM Hacks: When others go Right, try going Left
« Reply #19 on: May 25, 2020, 12:36:40 pm »
Eurgh.....i've tried to play this, but right as the first soldiers in Narshe rushed on me, the screen just faded to black and.....nothing else. I couldn't even fight a single time.
I was playing on my Raspberry 3, Recalbox.
I'm sorry, I'm not sure what could be happening here.  The patch was developed on and tested with SNES9X, using the 1.0 US version of the ROM.  It is dependent on the original location of the sketch bug since it builds on the Assassin fix rather than the FF3-1.1 release of the sketch fix... if another version of the game is used the asm will point to the wrong place and the code will crash, causing a black screen like that (or scrolling red lines).
Could it be an emulator incompatibility?

First off this is a great hack, the changes the author did in the first part of the game did make the story more detailed from the original, I can't wait to reach the WoR to see the massive changes compared to the base game.

Now I'm not sure if this is because of bad luck or something else but I can't make the magicite ZoneSeeker to appear in the auction house after two hours ingame. Maybe I should keep trying?
Zonezeek isn't in the auction house anymore, you will get this esper as part of the scenario later.  I was scolded about this elsewhere and the readme will be updated next time I submit a patch update.