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Author Topic: Zelda II Redux  (Read 12997 times)

ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #100 on: April 25, 2018, 01:18:45 pm »
- Reduce the hit points, but as a tradeoff, also reduce the experience points. Plus, don't make them regenerate between screens (there's a flag for that in Enemy Attributes tables), to avoid obvious grinding.
Oh! I completely forgot there was a bit for respawning the enemy!
I think I'm gonna go for this option.
Making them non-respawnable would kinda fix the possible Exp grinding so early on.
I found them starting at 0x011571, changing the 46 to 06 seems to do it.
Though I gotta be honest, I intended to do this to make my life easier through the game :D
Perhaps I'll modify the byte back when I make my own ROM haha.

So I'd most likely do this option, thanks for the suggestion!

Btw, Trax, I gave the disassembly of the dialogue boxes a read, but I cannot seem to get the hang of it. :/
The LDYs and all of the addresses with "($XXXX),y" really confuse me, I am but a mere noob at ASM and haven't really learned how to handle those (nor the LDX ones) xP
Could you give any clue on what I should be looking for to make the 7 lines change to the dialogue boxes, please?
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 01:34:41 pm by ShadowOne333 »

IcePenguin

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #101 on: April 25, 2018, 09:19:37 pm »
Come on, it's the last palace, it's supposed to be hard as hell. Great Palace = Great Difficulty...

As for the Fokkas. Yes, they are hard, but it's not like you hack your sword in all directions until they (or you) die. Like any other enemy, they have a pattern and you study the pattern to beat them.

I agree with Trax.  It makes me think of Iron Knuckles.  Iron Knuckles are very challenging to fight if you don't know what to do, but once you learn that (lame) jumping slash, they become no better an obstacle than a skeleton.  Fokkas are easy to kill, just like Iron Knuckles.  You just gotta learn how to do it, as Trax described in his post.  ;)

Speaking of jumping slash, I'd like to see a hack that removes it and makes Iron Knuckles even harder!  Mwa ha ha.   >:D

ultimaweapon

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #102 on: April 25, 2018, 09:40:42 pm »
Or give the Blue Ironknuckles a boatload of HP. LOL!

Good to see you post on this thread Ice Penguin.

The only thing I would like to see changed for all of you advanced hackers is to have all of the previous bosses from the 1st 6 palaces included in the Great Palace like other Zelda games. I'd like to see Hammerhead, Helmethead, Rebonack, Carock, Gooma, and Barba make an appearance in the Great Palace.
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Trax

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #103 on: April 25, 2018, 11:57:37 pm »
ShadowOne. Don't forget to make the changes for Bubbles in Palaces Type A, B and Great Palace. These are 3 distinct tables. Also, Fast and Slow. Also, Big Bubble in Great Palace, if you want to tweak this enemy too. As for the regeneration, what you did is correct. This is the structure table for that Attributes Table:

Code: [Select]
11541: Other Enemy Attributes (24 bytes) (6E41 in RAM)

x... .... Immune to Thunder Spell
.x.. .... Regenerates
..x. .... ? (never used)
...x .... Not hittable with sword
.... xxxx ? (0 or 6)

As for the town dialogues, I think what may elude hackers the most is the use of what I call "PPU Macros". To change tiles, most often background tiles, most game use macros that act as a "command" to tell the system what to change and where. It's usually in the 3xx part of RAM, starting at 301. The structure of the string that composes a macro is usually like this:

Code: [Select]
AA BB BB CC DD ... 0xFF
AA = Number of bytes to process (a single letter in a Zelda II dialog needs 5 bytes processed).
BB BB = Offset in RAM, usually in PPU space between 0000 and 1FFF. Big endian, so the most significant byte first.
CC = Number of tiles to draw, and whether you want to draw tiles horizontally or vertically (bit 7 set = draw vertically). I think bit 6 could be a Repeat flag. A letter drawn uses the value 82.
DD = Tile Codes to draw, as many as needed.
0xFF = End Byte. I think you can chain macros by starting another one instead of putting FF there. The value FF simply means "stop processing macros".

ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #104 on: April 26, 2018, 03:04:36 pm »
Yep, I will update the tables for Temple A, B and Great Palace to match for the Bubbles in all their variants.
One question though, do they follow the same order for each one?
Like the table at 0x011551 has the order of the enemies listed before the table, but the one at 0x012A51 does not, neither does the one for the Great Palace at 0x15551. Just want to make sure the order is the same in terms of enemy listing.

As for the Dialog boxes, I tried to debug the RAM Address $301 and found out it calls this particular code:
Code: [Select]
LC11C                                                                          ;
ldx      bank7_table0,y                ; 0x1c12c $C11C BE 5D C0                ;
lda      #$00                          ; 0x1c12f $C11F A9 00                   ; A = 00
sta      $0301,x                       ; 0x1c131 $C121 9D 01 03                ;
lda      #$FF                          ; 0x1c134 $C124 A9 FF                   ; A = FF
sta      L0302,x                       ; 0x1c136 $C126 9D 02 03                ;
lda      $0725                         ; 0x1c139 $C129 AD 25 07                ;; PPU Macro Selector
The STAs there when running the "WELCOME TO RAURU" sign in the first town effectively store 05 in $301 and I believe 24 in $302. Am I in the right track?

Trax

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #105 on: April 26, 2018, 11:48:51 pm »
You are in the NMI routine, and it looks like a reset operation for the current frame. You should just stick to the code in bank 3. Your goal is to have the letter tile and the accent tile swapped. You also have to move down the offset one tile, so that you still start at the same first line as in the original setup, but have the letter tile at the top of the two-tile setup. This way, you only overwrite the tile under the "writing head", so it doesn't actually draw over anything since it's already empty.

If you start at F6DD, you'll see the code that sets the letter tile, the accent tile, and the macro to draw it. My disassembly has comments on the operations.

ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #106 on: April 27, 2018, 06:10:27 pm »
Oh I do remember I did some changes there, but couldn't make much of it.
I am inclined to say this is the portion that I should be looking into:
Code: [Select]
adc      $048A                         ; 0xf736 $B726 6D 8A 04                 ; Letter Y Position offset
sta      $0303                         ; 0xf739 $B729 8D 03 03                 ;; Letter position when writing to screen
lda       !$03                         ; 0xf73c $B72C AD 03 00                 ;
adc      #$00                          ; 0xf73f $B72F 69 00                    ;
sta      L0302                         ; 0xf741 $B731 8D 02 03                 ;; Used when writing text to screen
lda      #$82                          ; 0xf744 $B734 A9 82                    ; A = 82
sta      $0304                         ; 0xf746 $B736 8D 04 03                 ;; Text memory offset?
stx      $0305                         ; 0xf749 $B739 8E 05 03                 ; tile above current letter
lda      #$FF                          ; 0xf74c $B73C A9 FF                    ; A = FF
sta      $0307                         ; 0xf74e $B73E 8D 07 03                 ;; Text memory offset?
lda      #$05                          ; 0xf751 $B741 A9 05                    ; A = 05
sta      $0301                         ; 0xf753 $B743 8D 01 03                 ;;ppu number of bytes following (counts both instructions and tile data values); Used when writing

I tried doing some modifications here, still no luck but I'm still trying.
Something interesting though, I modified this line here:

Code: [Select]
bcs      LB6E7                         ; 0xf6f1 $B6E1 B0 04                    ; skip to $F6E7

I changed the BCS $F6E7 [B0 04] to BCS $F6ED [B0 0A] and noticed that the tiles were now switched and the upper one wasn't being overwritten. Though it was all garbage data, but at least it switched tiles for a while lol.
I will keep looking into this in the meanwhile.

Thanks for all the help, @Trax, hope I am not being too much of a bother due to my serious lack of ASM knowledge.
It is very appreciated!

ultimaweapon

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #107 on: May 01, 2018, 01:30:46 pm »
@Trax - How much progress have you made on you new editor Sword 2 and your new Zelda 2 hack?

@ShadowOne - Thanks for your help with palettes. I've finally been effective with changing palettes. I haven't found everyone I need yet, but I'm getting there. I need the location to change palettes when Link uses magic and the palettes where Link uses Shield magic. I've found just about everything else I needed.
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ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #108 on: May 02, 2018, 02:07:51 pm »
Man I've been having quite the struggle with that Dialog box thing. XP
I haven't been able to get it working yet :/

I am still trying though, I can't give up with this if I want to have proper lengthy sentences to avoid being limited in text length.

@Trax - How much progress have you made on you new editor Sword 2 and your new Zelda 2 hack?

@ShadowOne - Thanks for your help with palettes. I've finally been effective with changing palettes. I haven't found everyone I need yet, but I'm getting there. I need the location to change palettes when Link uses magic and the palettes where Link uses Shield magic. I've found just about everything else I needed.
The colour for Link after the Shield spell is found at 0x000E9D.
In there you will see [A9 16], that's the LDA opcode that loads up the red palette once Link activates the Shield Spell.
Change the $16 to whatever other Hex ID of palette you desire.

What other palette do you need besides the one when Link uses Shield?

ultimaweapon

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #109 on: May 02, 2018, 02:16:48 pm »
Man I've been having quite the struggle with that Dialog box thing. XP
I haven't been able to get it working yet :/

I am still trying though, I can't give up with this if I want to have proper lengthy sentences to avoid being limited in text length.
The colour for Link after the Shield spell is found at 0x000E9D.
In there you will see [A9 16], that's the LDA opcode that loads up the red palette once Link activates the Shield Spell.
Change the $16 to whatever other Hex ID of palette you desire.

What other palette do you need besides the one when Link uses Shield?

I need the ones for when casts a spell that is NOT the SHIELD spell. It changes from the new color I have him back to the Green & Red.

I hope you are able to get the dialog box working. I'm sure it's quite the pain.

I'm still trying to find a way to fix my midair jump from being infinite to just 1 midair jump preferably 2 at most. That is a pain right now too.
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Shadic

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #110 on: May 02, 2018, 05:35:03 pm »
What's the exact size for text boxes that you're going for? Any other limitations?

I'd love to start work on rewriting the text to match the increased box size... Even if it's not done yet.

ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #111 on: May 02, 2018, 06:34:09 pm »
I need the ones for when casts a spell that is NOT the SHIELD spell. It changes from the new color I have him back to the Green & Red.

I hope you are able to get the dialog box working. I'm sure it's quite the pain.

I'm still trying to find a way to fix my midair jump from being infinite to just 1 midair jump preferably 2 at most. That is a pain right now too.
So you mean changing the colours of the flashes when you use the spells?

What's the exact size for text boxes that you're going for? Any other limitations?

I'd love to start work on rewriting the text to match the increased box size... Even if it's not done yet.
It's not the dialog box size I'm trying to change, but rather get rid of the empty tile above each line of text that gets printed.
This would make it so that we can have 7 lines of text instead of the normal 4.

Shadic

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #112 on: May 02, 2018, 06:45:51 pm »
So ten characters wide, with seven rows?

I wish the width could be increased to like, 12, but I can't imagine that would be easy either!

ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #113 on: May 02, 2018, 07:11:41 pm »
I think someone mentioned this before, I think it was Trax or IcePenguin, but basically the conclusion was that it was much easier to get rid of the empty row of tiles that separates each text line to have 7 lines of text per dialog box, because increasing the size of the box itself proved to be quite problematic, both in ASM and palette stuff.

So, with that said, the solution given is what I'm trying to achieve at the moment, unsuccessful so far lol but still trying.

ultimaweapon

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #114 on: May 02, 2018, 09:26:16 pm »
@ShadowOne - When you use a spell that's not Shield, Link flashes and then he changes back into his Green and Red, but when you use SHIELD spell, Link flashes and then turns red. You were spot on about the Shield spell. I need the palettes for when he uses other spells. Somehow, I changed the red to black(don't know where I found it), but I have yet to find the green, so I can change it.
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RetroProf

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #115 on: May 03, 2018, 04:38:59 am »
I've been meaning to replay Zelda II patched to make it less frustrating and more fair, so it's great to see this topic.

My previous plan had been to double patch Zelda II with Njosro's Palace Patch:
http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3859/

And also tog's Easy patch:
http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/1084/

However, this new patch as described in this thread already includes the Palace Patch. So... What are the main difference's to Tog's Easy Patch? They seem similar, for example magic costing less and enemies requiring less hits.

However, I very much like ShadowOne333's improvement of no lost EXP - that was supremely annoying in the original. Plus there's some graphic improvements and save improvements.

But at the same time, there's a lot of talk here suggesting changes to make the game MORE difficult in some ways. Increasing HP for some enemies, or putting a boss rush in the final palace. I utterly despise boss rushes in games - they're boring. I've beaten those bosses already, I literally never, ever want to see them again. They're done, a closed chapter, forget about them.

Also reverting to the AWFUL levelling system of the FDS original. Dear god no!! SCD said it was easier in the FDS version, but it absolutely was not.
Quote
When you save and quit, all three levels are reduced to the lowest one you had of any of the three upgrades (for example, if you had Lv. 8 Attack, Lv. 5 Magic, and Lv. 3 Life, they would all be reset to Level 3). In the NES version, all levels are always retained between sessions.


What the hell? Why would any of us want to revert to this broken system? I intend to play on a FlashCart with real saving, not Quick Saves on an emu, which would negate this problem. I don't want to level my Attack to 8, switch off, only to see all that EXP wasted and reduced down to 1 or 3 or whatever the lowest is.

That system is TERRIBLE. It forces you to level every single thing up one at a time, at the same time, and it prevents you from switching the game off until all three are at the same level. You've got AML up to levels 8, 7, and 6? Well sorry, you can't switch off until you also level up M and L as well.

The FDS levelling system is pure hot garbage since it wastes untold quantities of hard fought for EXP. It's like a TAX on saving your game. Want to save? Pay the tax man all the EXP you gained.

That's the kind of insanity Working Designs would pull.

PLEASE DO NOT REIMPLEMENT THE FDS LEVELLING SYSTEM. PLEASE. PLEASE.

We also went from a reduced 5 hits for the bubbles up to 10, even though I personally would have been cool with just 1 hit (they're bubbles, they should pop easily). At least that's what I read when speed skimming through this thread, not sure if the 10 was actually implemented.

So now I'm conflicted. I do like this new patch, but it's starting to get weird, and complicated, and harder than the original game in some small ways?

What if I mixed all 3 patches together?

Should I just wait for a more final version of this patch?

I basically want the Palace Patch, plus the main game to be easier, more fair, actually winnable, but without any nonsense like "getting more EXP" and then rebalancing that with enemies who have more HP. I find this is the problem with pretty much every single improvement patch for all games. It starts leaning in one direction, so to rebalance that it goes in the opposite direction, and we end up with a weird mess which is frustrating.



« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 04:57:06 am by RetroProf »

PresidentLeever

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #116 on: May 03, 2018, 07:53:17 am »
PLEASE DO NOT REIMPLEMENT THE FDS LEVELLING SYSTEM. PLEASE. PLEASE.

We also went from a reduced 5 hits for the bubbles up to 10, even though I personally would have been cool with just 1 hit (they're bubbles, they should pop easily). At least that's what I read when speed skimming through this thread, not sure if the 10 was actually implemented.

Agreed on the leveling and not going too far with implementing new things for its own sake I guess, but it's not in the OP so I don't think it's going in?

The issue with the bubbles is high exp gain for little effort and farming opportunities, while tougher enemies sometimes give poor rewards.
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itemdrop

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #117 on: May 03, 2018, 08:14:15 am »
the reality is your never gonna please everyone. everyone has there own taste own ideas of what made the game great and what made it bad. I think you're suggestion to yourself RetroProf is probably the best in that you could amalgamate all the things you want in your own version. its not a bad idea.

PresidentLeever

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #118 on: May 03, 2018, 09:41:05 am »
If popularity is a goal, ShadowOne should shape the hack around the most common criticisms of the original.
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ShadowOne333

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Re: Zelda II Redux
« Reply #119 on: May 03, 2018, 10:11:44 am »
@RetroProf:
If it's not stated in the OP, it hasn't been implemented/planned at the moment.
I originally wanted to implement the Easy patch into this, but I feel like there are way too many changes in that patch which makes the game too much of an "Easy" thing all the way, which is why I preferred to only focus on changes to certain enemies, and not all of them, mainly the most obnoxious ones to make the game more enjoyable and not too much of a hassle.

I also implemented some changes to the Magic consumption, because in the original the magic barely even lasted if you used 2-3 spells in a row.

First and foremost, I want this patch to tackle the most annoying aspects of Zelda II, rework them in a way that feels fair and balanced, to make the overall experience a better trip all the way throughout.
Right now, you can test the patch in the OP, should be the latest so far (without the palette changes yet).
Try it out and let me know what do you think of it.

If at all, at the end you can still patch the Easy patch over this one, I haven't repointed anything related to enemies or magic consumption, which is what the Easy patch focuses on.
I haven't done changes to the levelling system at all, it isn't pointed in the OP I believe, so at the moment no plans until I get through the Dialog box to have more lines of text, and the palettes for Link and some NPCs (I really don't like the pink $36 palette for almost every skin tone, I feel $37 fits way better).

Quote
So now I'm conflicted. I do like this new patch, but it's starting to get weird, and complicated, and harder than the original game in some small ways?
What do you mean by this?