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Author Topic: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches  (Read 2462 times)

ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2018, 04:30:15 pm »


In this image, you see that I added a bridge in the entrance of the Tower of Hera. It was one idea I was exploring as part of the hack is not only to make the level design less linear, but also add more complexity to the dungeons.  All the medallions are to be made optional (mainly because I find them to be too strong) and I had a later patch where I edited the overlay to keep the entrance of Misery Mire open.  Those tower of hera images btw are not in the main hack.  The cave entrance from the potion shop is not either, but the entrance was originally west of it where there was a fairy fountain.  I don't want to spoil too many surprises, but just enough to show ideas that I had in mind. 

One idea I have is to remove the "rescue phase" and start with the shield and sword. Hyrule Castle could be a combined dungeon and while it has a key item required for the tower section, it can be obtained at any time.

PresidentLeever

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2018, 06:13:16 pm »
Definitely interested in a less linear version of Zelda 3 with some balance tweaks to make it work, but not sure about the other ideas. Maybe there could be two versions.
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ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2018, 06:53:53 pm »
What are you referring to?  Anyway, one idea I have is to have an open world design similar to Zelda 1 and ALBW. the other could be the second quest where dungeons are more challenging.  most side quests will be item gated and while some dungeons can be played out of order, there will be a chain of gated items just like Zelda 1's second quest.  I just want to get the ASM's and hex edits out of the way before I can consider this sort of design, but one thing that would remain is having non-linear dungeon design, the pyramid of power becomes a dungeon (inspired by the Hylian Legacy Patch), but can still be accessed early aside from battling Ganon.

the over world in the more linear hack would remain the same where item gates only function as shortcuts but do not bar the player from any critical path (although some key items might be found in caves).  Some dungeons could be partially completed as well where you can get the item, but it still cannot be finished without a previous item (e.g. OoT's Water Temple and level 5 in the first quest of Zelda 1). 


Thanatos-Zero

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2018, 09:21:18 pm »
If you do not mind, could you make use of my **Zelda - Legend of Link sprites** for the Zelda 1 Improvement?
In any case I am a bit hyped now to play your hacks. >:D

PresidentLeever

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2018, 09:38:54 pm »
What are you referring to?  Anyway, one idea I have is to have an open world design similar to Zelda 1 and ALBW. the other could be the second quest where dungeons are more challenging.  most side quests will be item gated and while some dungeons can be played out of order, there will be a chain of gated items just like Zelda 1's second quest.  I just want to get the ASM's and hex edits out of the way before I can consider this sort of design, but one thing that would remain is having non-linear dungeon design, the pyramid of power becomes a dungeon (inspired by the Hylian Legacy Patch), but can still be accessed early aside from battling Ganon.

the over world in the more linear hack would remain the same where item gates only function as shortcuts but do not bar the player from any critical path (although some key items might be found in caves).  Some dungeons could be partially completed as well where you can get the item, but it still cannot be finished without a previous item (e.g. OoT's Water Temple and level 5 in the first quest of Zelda 1).

Removing the rescue and making the dungeons more complex, I rather like the intro and it's pretty short anyway. But for a second quest hack absolutely.
I dunno about partially completable dungeons, not a problem with the mirror I suppose. But would also have to try it to see if it's really a problem, in terms of backtracking.
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ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2018, 10:02:19 pm »
Thanks to some help, I can now work on an improvement hack for Zelda1.  I want to still retain the difficult balance of the both quests, but have no vital items not skippable in any dungeon.  Level 7 second quest will have the red candle available because using the blue candle to find it was too cruel. Level  will be in level 7's location and level 6 will instead have a heart container. I have not decided if I want the raft to be paid or the power bracelet. one of the heart containers will require the bombs and stepladder

January 06, 2018, 10:52:31 pm - (Auto Merged - Double Posts are not allowed before 7 days.)
Removing the rescue and making the dungeons more complex, I rather like the intro and it's pretty short anyway. But for a second quest hack absolutely.
I dunno about partially completable dungeons, not a problem with the mirror I suppose. But would also have to try it to see if it's really a problem, in terms of backtracking.

I figured that it does not follow a rigid linear formula.  Take Skull Woods for example. I could set up the dungeon where you can get the item, but give an indicator early on in the dungeon that you will need other items to finish the dungeon. Now these rooms can be accessed later, but I want to bring back that structure Zelda 1 had.  In Level 6, you need the stepladder, but you can still enter the dungeon from the start to get the magic rod.  Some of the dungeon items will be optional, and they can be gated as well.  Keep in mind that having partial completed dungeons only occurs if you play them out of order. 

Honestly, the intro can get annoying when you keep playtesting it and yes while it is brief, I would like to implement it where it can be done later.  In other words, you can go and get the pendants, and Zelda still needs to be rescued (you get a key item in the same dungeon where you rescue Zelda that is required to reach the master sword).

As for backtracking, I minimize this issue by adding more shortcuts. In the Thieve's Hideout, I made changes to add a few more shortcuts.  Every dungeon is to have at least one optional key. 

Anyway, I forgot to mention that I need to edit the damage classes for consistency purposes. Unfortunately, I did not update the patch and I made it before i discovered superskuj's sprite editor, which is pretty much hyrule add-ons but better.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2018, 10:52:31 pm by ChaosPrime8 »

PresidentLeever

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #26 on: January 07, 2018, 08:23:23 am »
Sounds like you have it figured out pretty well. On the rescue part, I think it would be silly if you spent time doing other stuff when the uncle is lying there dying in the cellar for.. how long? And most of the end users are not playtesters. But perhaps others would agree with you.
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ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #27 on: January 07, 2018, 03:15:05 pm »
Actually that is going to be deleted.  Also, gameplay sometimes has no logic when it comes to story. For example, the old man in death mountain is standing the in the same spot in the cave even if you leave the desert temple.  Majora's Mask is usually more consistent about this sort of design because of the time limit but even when you turn back time, plor paradoxes occur such as defeating Twinmold does not place the king of Ikana to rest.  Honestly, my concern is more about the game design than the story even if the logic makes no sense.

Other changes include a test closer to the Japanese version (I need to make a hex edit to rename the flute to the Ocarina}.  Also, I need to insert the bug fix patch for the cane of somaria. 

IAmCaptPlanet

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2018, 11:17:24 pm »
actually, these would all be a pretty cool things to put into Zelda 1, and would be my dream version

i would like to have a hack for Legend of Zelda vanilla that added 4 things from Zelda - The Legend of Link http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/2136/

1. add sword techniques - sword swiping and spin charge attack

2. saving in the inventory menu

3. the select 3 items with the "select" button (or a way to 'set' an item to select, say press select to drop a bomb and keep B for boomer-rang)

4. Add a map feature (like Legend of Link has) the old man at the beginning could say "It's dangerous to go alone, take this sword and seek out these dungeons" and give you a map with the dungeon locations

i know all that could be done in Zelda 1 since it's in the Legend of Link hack

5. the cool automap hack would be amazing to add as well. http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/796/

anyways, that would be my dream version of Zelda 1. i think a lot of people would appreciate a hack like that.

ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2018, 06:16:48 am »

I feel like those ideas could work in a link's awakening hack.  I am going to hack all of the pure 2D titles (at least the top downs). 

My objective is to give each title the same pacing as zelda 1 where story gates are almost non-existent, fetch quests that add no challenge are either deleted or become side quests, and item gates are less frequent for the main quest.  Zelda 1's freedom is fine, but I am removing the shutter doors that can lead to potential soft locks. 

ChaosPrime8

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Re: Zelda1 and 3 improvement patches
« Reply #30 on: January 20, 2018, 06:02:11 pm »
as an update on my zelda 1 hack. i need playtesters because some of the dungeons are very difficult to keep track of the level design.  all dungeons will have an escape path from the boss room that does not require killing any enemies. trap rooms that can lead to unwinnable situations also need to be checked.