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Author Topic: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?  (Read 3935 times)

justin3009

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Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« on: March 06, 2016, 09:53:04 am »
I'm not sure if this would go in Gaming Discussion or ROM Hacking Discussion.. forgive me about that.  What exactly would you change about this game to improve it being game play, aesthetics, attacks, equipment, characters, etc.?

1. Personally, I think some party members should be more optional along the way, mainly Jean as an example.  I'm not a fan of him whatsoever and he doesn't seem very viable in any instance.. not too mention his story portion of the game is one gigantic pain in the ass mundane task that does nothing.  I'd love for it to be a huge side-quest where you could get him, obviously he'd have to be rebalanced, but it'd be more interesting to me in that aspect.  It'd be interesting to see Nimufu come into play as a little guest character as well.  I'd say Ray for that very temporary part of the game as a 'hard set' PC with no chance of full recruitment as well.  Obviously a lot of work for something so little, but a bit more variety doesn't hurt.

2. I'd kill for more background on Patty (Yua)'s life.  There's hardly any mention of her at all by Ryu or even anyone else in the game world, what the heck actually happened to her throughout her years?

3. Variety of weapons kind of like Breath of Fire 1 as a very slim example.  Having Ryu being able to use the Boomerang or a Sword was actually a really nice touch.

4. More Shaman form variations.  I know they gave story reasons for Ryu being the Brood and all.. which is a bit weird considering he's only half-brood.  Either way, I'd say allow him to fuse with Shamans.  In this instance, I'd say a good trade off would be he gains enhanced stats depending on the Shaman, like other PCs, but to compensate for the overly destructive blood, one of his other stats would have to go down.  (Gear wise this could be easily made up since he seems to have more equipment than half of anyone).

5. Maybe a bit more inclusion on Myria near the end of the game.  The final boss is a spawn of her, but it'd be a bit more satsifying to hear more about her as you continue in the game, just remnants of the past.  Maybe even have Deis say something about it here and there.  (Though the fact she's playable was really forced in at last second as seen by her non-existent stab table and random checks to specifically check for her in code).
'We have to find some way to incorporate the general civilians in the plot.'

'We'll kill off children in the Juuban district with an infection where they cough up blood and are found hanging themselves from cherry blossom trees.'

Bregalad

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2016, 10:27:47 am »
Well - I basically agree with what you said.

First of all, you seemeed to assume that Patty = Yua, but if I remember well, this is never explicited in the game and is only a conjecture. Much like Yunalesca = Linoa in FF8 for example. If it is explicited somehwere, then I apologize and ignore this comment.

The section where you should find Jean is incredibly annoying. Especially the music. However the character I liked the less was the monkey. I forgot his name and anyway it didn't matter since I never used him. I didn't use Jean much either.

There is a lot of things in this game that turned out to be worse than in the original Breath of Fire, but it's hard to point out something exactly. The soundtrack is definitely lacking, maybe importing some music from other BOF games wouldn't be a bad idea in order to widen the palette of available songs.

The Shaman variations are amazing and are the #1 selling point of this game (along with the dark, serious story line).

justin3009

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2016, 10:39:31 am »
Yeah, Patty is not full on said to be his sister, but the hints are dropped everywhere that it's hard to ignore.  Nina even flat out says that they look similar.  There's also the fact her hair color and eye color are the same as Ryu's, not too mention she's also apart of the dragon clan.  She at the end gets slapped away and shouts 'Brother!'.  The only other Dragon Clan member I believe that was out and about was Ray, and Patty was the only female I can actually remember that's up there with them.  I'm going to undeniably say she's his sister, it's almost too hard not to believe with all the hints.

I absolutely agree with the Jean bit.  I really did not enjoy it one bit and it just felt lackluster as heck.  There was no real relevance to any plot there, then again, he was supposed to be the 'joke' character so it makes sense in that regard.

Sten was one of my favorites to use in battle for awhile (The monkey).  His section was pretty decent story wise honestly, though execution felt a bit rough, he was better off than Jean thankfully.

The soundtrack was a hit and miss for me.  Some of the tracks were quite well done but some were just.. eh.  I'm really not a big fan of second battle theme as you progress through the game.  Maybe if it had a bit more tempo it'd probably feel better, though, the first battle theme was one of my favorites for awhile.

The Shaman variations was really interesting and fun.  I can see why there's only a few variations, though, it's hilarious that Aspara had technically four while everyone else had one or two.
'We have to find some way to incorporate the general civilians in the plot.'

'We'll kill off children in the Juuban district with an infection where they cough up blood and are found hanging themselves from cherry blossom trees.'

Chronosplit

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2016, 11:46:49 am »
More Shaman fusions would be at the top of my list.  You wouldn't even need to put in Ryu for that to be doable.

Bosch auto-leveling when returning to the party would be nice.  He ends up too low to be usable when he returns most times.

KingMike

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2016, 12:24:31 pm »
I recall being able to get him caught up pretty quickly in the event dungeon after he returns.
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Zynk

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2016, 08:21:41 pm »
I bit off-topic but BoF related, it would be great if Karn was replaced with Patty so that the fusion skill is pretty much close to BoF2's.

Or replace Karn with Katt and make were-tiger fusion variants. Seriously, Karn is a broken character, he was even a black guy originally but turned white in the US.

On topic, Jean, Sten and the others needs to be rebalanced, like Jean could have more healing or support spells, or tranform to a huge frog (were-frog? lol), Sten could have better skill(magic) attacks. Nina can be the main healer again. Katt can do a were-tiger form. I really like Katt... and BoF2.

zonk47

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2016, 10:14:08 pm »
I bit off-topic but BoF related, it would be great if Karn was replaced with Patty so that the fusion skill is pretty much close to BoF2's.

Or replace Karn with Katt and make were-tiger fusion variants. Seriously, Karn is a broken character, he was even a black guy originally but turned white in the US.

On topic, Jean, Sten and the others needs to be rebalanced, like Jean could have more healing or support spells, or tranform to a huge frog (were-frog? lol), Sten could have better skill(magic) attacks. Nina can be the main healer again. Katt can do a were-tiger form. I really like Katt... and BoF2.

Karn was black? Maybe a restoration is in order...

I thought BoF II the weakest game in the entire series. Everything about it painfully generic. You've got the Oliver Twist ripoff at the beginning, followed by flat dialogue and a villain who got less development than most of the guys in BoF. Really BoF had decent character development... a few trolls but for each of those, someone you could kind of relate to. If the script were just rewritten from scratch, I think I'd be able to make my way all the way through it. (my cousin showed me the boss so that's how I know about him)
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justin3009

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2016, 10:35:01 am »
I definitely want to see more variety on weapons for characters. Maybe Katt being able to use her staff, Bagh Naka and something else as an example.

Rebalancing on all accounts, enemy and PC wise I feel is a must.

The retranslation was done, but maybe more character and enemy development so things feel more relevant and consistent instead of scattered.

More spells that aren't clones of other spells with higher damage or effects.

I'd LOVE to see the spell system from BOF3/4 included where you can learn certain ones from enemies by guarding. Spell combos would be awesome too!

Possibly the inclusion of Masters as well, would give more need to rebalance everything.
'We have to find some way to incorporate the general civilians in the plot.'

'We'll kill off children in the Juuban district with an infection where they cough up blood and are found hanging themselves from cherry blossom trees.'

I.S.T.

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2016, 07:21:36 pm »
I'd be fine with the XP and gold doubled to match the GBA version. The SNES version is a bit grindy. Removing that would be rather nice.
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ThegreatBen

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2016, 10:37:29 pm »
I've actually been working on rebalancing the first two games as well as making them more consistent with the 3rd one, I used the gba versions because I found them to be much more polished, for 2 the biggest thing for balancing is spreading the stat gains out. And upping that cursed drop rate.

For the first game it was a massive rebalance, the LP is on YouTube levels weapons armor and stat gains all rebalanced. Also sped up equipment farming from the flea market.

I know everything about these games content and a decent amount of rom information if you need help.


Bregalad

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2016, 02:06:56 am »
I'd be fine with the XP and gold doubled to match the GBA version. The SNES version is a bit grindy. Removing that would be rather nice.
I only played to the end with the GBA version, and I found it awfully grindy (the last dungeon I mean). I cannot imagine what the SNES version is like.

zonk47

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2016, 06:34:36 pm »
BoF could be improved by doubling the duration of Mrbl3 (the random encounter suppression item).

Also nerf the underwater enemies around Gobi's town... he gets killed when it's just him looking for the gills.
A good slave does not realize he is one; the best slave will not accept that he has become one.

ThegreatBen

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2016, 09:05:20 pm »
@zonk47 I addressed one of those in my hack, Gobi starts a few levels higher so he has some spells to defend himself. The full list of changes I've made can be found here. http://dragon-brood.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=957

Once I can switch the Shin and Debo spells I'll release this, that and I still got to speed up Mogus levels but that's just a matter of motivation.

Volcannon

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2017, 01:38:32 am »
I wish there was an editor to change the names of the characters. Some of the names for the retranslation (Lin for example) bug the heck out of me and I would love to change it back to Katt.
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ze10

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2017, 10:47:19 am »
My biggest issue with the game is how hard it is to run from encounters. It's ridiculous, specially considering how high the encounter rate is. So changing that would definitely be on the top of my list. My second biggest issue is how your transformations get undone after every single cutscene and how annoying it is to get them back.

einlanzer

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2017, 05:17:14 pm »
Most of Bof2 is fine (other than the translation, hahhah. The major changes I would make:

-Make it so you only lose shamans when you die, as opposed to being weak
-Give Holy shaman a base stat increase
-Change Bleu/Deis to function like a more normal character by starting at a lower level (20 or 25) and normalizing her stat growth

and a few character changes:

-Remove Ryu's Cure & Cure 2, and instead give him Exit and Warp
-Give Nina Cure, Cure 2, Renew, and Cure Psn so she functions as more of a sage. Remove Death and Fire magic. This makes her more similar to BoFIV's Nina
-Give Sten Death & buff his Wisdom a bit so he's more like a speedy black mage with decent fighting ability
-Give Spar Cure 3 so he can be a decent party support
-Buff Jean's Str and Sta so he's not useless outside of shaman form
-Modest buff to all of Bow's stats
-Modest buff to Katt's HP
-Reduce AP costs on Cure, Cure 2, and Cure X (3, 7, 35 respectively)

I actually did a lot of this in hack I was working on, but I couldn't figure out how to fix Bleu's stat growth so I sort of abandoned it.

« Last Edit: October 05, 2017, 05:23:55 pm by einlanzer »

justin3009

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2018, 04:52:18 pm »
Most of Bof2 is fine (other than the translation, hahhah. The major changes I would make:

-Make it so you only lose shamans when you die, as opposed to being weak
-Give Holy shaman a base stat increase
-Change Bleu/Deis to function like a more normal character by starting at a lower level (20 or 25) and normalizing her stat growth

and a few character changes:

-Remove Ryu's Cure & Cure 2, and instead give him Exit and Warp
-Give Nina Cure, Cure 2, Renew, and Cure Psn so she functions as more of a sage. Remove Death and Fire magic. This makes her more similar to BoFIV's Nina
-Give Sten Death & buff his Wisdom a bit so he's more like a speedy black mage with decent fighting ability
-Give Spar Cure 3 so he can be a decent party support
-Buff Jean's Str and Sta so he's not useless outside of shaman form
-Modest buff to all of Bow's stats
-Modest buff to Katt's HP
-Reduce AP costs on Cure, Cure 2, and Cure X (3, 7, 35 respectively)

I actually did a lot of this in hack I was working on, but I couldn't figure out how to fix Bleu's stat growth so I sort of abandoned it.

I'm so sorry about missing this post until now.

The reason you couldn't figure out Bleu's stat growth is because they actually forgot to include it in the game. Her stat growth chart starts where the enemy groups are which is why her stats just sky rocket as she goes up. The entire stat growth table for all characters would 'have' to be moved and Bleu's essentially would have to be made from scratch. She legitimately was a last second add on from how it looks like on the internal code of everything which would explain a lot of the mess.
'We have to find some way to incorporate the general civilians in the plot.'

'We'll kill off children in the Juuban district with an infection where they cough up blood and are found hanging themselves from cherry blossom trees.'

Thanatos-Zero

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #17 on: January 11, 2018, 03:18:56 am »
I wish there was a kind of ritual, where Ryu goes into a deep meditative state, where he had to conquer himself. Doing this purifies and transforms Ryu's body and becomes a full blood Brood member.

2tack

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2018, 01:23:02 pm »
I'd really love the ability to, during any time possible, remove Ryu from the party. I feel party combinations without Ryu could be a lot of fun. More shamans of the same elements would be cool so you can build a super party, but they're super hard to track down. Patty being a playable character would be awesome, or maybe another Spar clone so you can utilize multiple of those shaman combinations at once.

justin3009

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Re: Breath of Fire II - What Would You Change?
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2018, 04:32:08 pm »
Definitely allowing Ryu to be removed from the party is one of the biggest things I wanted. I looked into it partially but the game really likes to soft lock in a lot of events without him there so there might have to be some serious event modifying to make it work.
'We have to find some way to incorporate the general civilians in the plot.'

'We'll kill off children in the Juuban district with an infection where they cough up blood and are found hanging themselves from cherry blossom trees.'