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Author Topic: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)  (Read 17900 times)

Midna

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #60 on: March 30, 2016, 06:31:45 am »
I vote against Gerudo King. The point of the hack is to make a fresh script for an old game, not to make connections to later games in the series.

MathUser2929

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #61 on: March 30, 2016, 01:05:05 pm »
What about "Dark King" or "Gerudo King"?

Darkling. I smell your blood. You're a vampire? Could it be?

w1ck3d

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #62 on: April 04, 2016, 10:45:42 am »
Finally got around to playing through 1st quest, while taking notes and through I'd offer some phrasing suggestions. There'd probably be more, but I'm sure I missed a few interactions and I have yet to play through 2nd quest relocalized.

Quote
It's dangerous to travel alone. Take this.

Choose, but choose wisely.

If you have the heart of a hero, I'll let you have this.

Arrows cost money. Try not to run out.

Best goods in the kingdom!

Show this to the old woman.

Buy a potion and be on your way.

Care to play a game of chance?

Walk into the waterfall.

Travel North, West, South, West, through the Lost Woods.

Use any tunnel you want.

Aim for the Gohma's eye.

Another adventure awaits our hero.
Press the start button.

Also I was thinking it'd be nice to redo the staff credits, so the real names are displayed with their pseudonyms. So it'd kinda look like this after.

Quote
Executive Producer
Hiroshi Yamauchi

Producer
Shigeru "Miyahon" Miyamoto

Directors
Shigeru "Miyahon" Miyamoto
Takashi "Ten Ten" Tezuka

Designer
Takashi "Ten Ten" Tezuka

Programmers
Toshihiko "Nakazoo" Nakago
Yasunari "Yachan" Soejima
Tatsuo "Marumaru" Nishiyama

Sound Composer
Koji "Konchan" Kondo

ShadowOne333

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #63 on: April 04, 2016, 10:54:07 am »
Finally got around to playing through 1st quest, while taking notes and through I'd offer some phrasing suggestions. There'd probably be more, but I'm sure I missed a few interactions and I have yet to play through 2nd quest relocalized.

Also I was thinking it'd be nice to redo the staff credits, so the real names are displayed with their pseudonyms. So it'd kinda look like this after.

The formatting for that part is stored as a table (I think)
I edited them once and the most I could do was print out the first name's first letter.and their last name.
i.e. MIYAHON = S.MIYAMOTO.

You would have to do some fancy stuff for that part if you were to put it like you mention.

KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #64 on: April 04, 2016, 06:56:30 pm »
Thanks for all suggestions! Much appreciated. SleepyFist, nice way of handling the limited space. How does it affect the music sync? The intro theme matches the visuals quite well if I remember correctly. Perhaps not noticeable with such a small difference?
How about something like this?

Long ago, Ganon, prince
of darkness, stole the
Triforce of Power.
Before Princess Zelda
was captured by Ganon's
minions, she split the
Triforce of Wisdom into
eight pieces and hid
them throughout Hyrule.
 "Link, find the pieces
    and save Zelda."


Ganon in red, Zelda in blue, Link in green. I really want this to read "throughout the land of Hyrule" instead, but ran out of space.
I agree with Oxhyde on the "minions" part, not mentioned in the manual story either. "across" instead of "throughout" is also a way to shorten it. Also, if you take the beginning from Nintendo's redo, you'll either need to have the comma after Ganon in red or include a double spacing. I prefer the original color coding though (characters and Triforces).

Other examples.

Long ago, the Demon King
Ganon stole the Triforce
of Power, and imprisoned
Princess Zelda. Before
she was captured, Zelda
split the Triforce of
Wisdom into eight pieces
and hid them across the
land...


"...land of Hyrule" would fit there as well.

Long ago, the Demon King
Ganon invaded Hyrule and
stole the Triforce of
Power. Before Princess
Zelda was captured, she
split the Triforce of
Wisdom into eight pieces
and hid them across the
land...


Are these two any better, worse or just as bad? :P
Finally got around to playing through 1st quest, while taking notes and through I'd offer some phrasing suggestions. There'd probably be more, but I'm sure I missed a few interactions and I have yet to play through 2nd quest relocalized.
Thanks! Nice suggestions. Agree that "travel" sounds better there, but we will also have to keep the formatting in mind.

current:

__It’s dangerous to go__
__alone. I’ll give you__
__this._________________


formatting options:

__It’s dangerous to_____
__travel alone.
__I’ll give you this.___

___It’s dangerous to____
___travel alone. I’ll___
___give you this._______

___It’s dangerous to____
___travel alone.________
___Take this.___________

___It’s dangerous to____
___travel alone. Take___
___this.________________


Also I was thinking it'd be nice to redo the staff credits, so the real names are displayed with their pseudonyms. So it'd kinda look like this after.
Someone else made a similar suggestion. I agree that it would be nice but it's not something I will attempt for this project. Also, Tatsuo Nishiyama and "Marumaru" is not the same person, he goes by the name I. Marui in the prototype version. It's unknown who I. Marui is, the only thing I know is that he returned as a programmer under the same pseudonym in Zelda II where you find Tatsuo Nishiyama under the name "Nishiyan". I. Marui (Marumaru) was also a programmer on Heart-Pounding Panic (Super Mario Bros. 2).

w1ck3d

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #65 on: April 05, 2016, 06:56:09 am »
Also, Tatsuo Nishiyama and "Marumaru" is not the same person, he goes by the name I. Marui in the prototype version. It's unknown who I. Marui is, the only thing I know is that he returned as a programmer under the same pseudonym in Zelda II where you find Tatsuo Nishiyama under the name "Nishiyan". I. Marui (Marumaru) was also a programmer on Heart-Pounding Panic (Super Mario Bros. 2).

Actually the Japanese wikipedia pages for Zelda II and Doki Doki Panic list Tatsuo Nishiyama as Marumaru, while the Japanese LOZ page list I.Marui (in English) as Marumaru. The general consensus seems to be that they're the same guy, but for whatever reason it's listed like that. Not sure where that "Nishiyan" business came from, but it's wrong.

Japanese LOZ wikipedia page
MARUMARU (I.MARUI)

Japanese Zelda II wikipedia page
MARUMARU(西山達夫) = Nishiyama Tatsuo
NISHIYAN(西田泰也) = Nishida Yasunari

Japanese Doki Doki Panic wikipedia page
MARUMARU(西山達夫) =Nishiyama Tatsuo

Japanese LOZIII wikipedia page
西山達夫 = Nishiyama Tatsuo
西田泰也 = Nishida Yasunari

KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #66 on: April 05, 2016, 09:11:19 am »
Excuse me while I go and eat my hat. ;)

Thanks for clearing that up, it's been a little mystery for me.  :beer: Tatsuo Nishiyama is also credited as Map Programmer in Super Mario World.

SleepyFist

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #67 on: April 05, 2016, 11:29:48 am »
Thanks for all suggestions! Much appreciated. SleepyFist, nice way of handling the limited space. How does it affect the music sync? The intro theme matches the visuals quite well if I remember correctly. Perhaps not noticeable with such a small difference?
Ive been playing with sound off but I've turned it back on to check, still seems to sync pretty well to me but any problems might be more apparent to someone who's played longer.
Sleepy's tune of the week|| Lost Lullabies (Unreleased Samurai Champloo tracks)|| https://youtu.be/BK6PR8DPNOw

w1ck3d

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #68 on: April 06, 2016, 12:43:17 pm »
Started to work my way through 2nd quest and I realized something I'd never noticed before, 2nd quest is structurally broken because of the changes in gameplay mechanics. What I mean is that due to pols voice being made weak to arrows due to the NES controller lacking a microphone, second quest is structurally broken because you do not get the bow til the 5th dungeon and pols voice is first introduced in the 2nd dungeon. I found it interesting, that they'd completely overlook this. Looked at the maps to vgmaps and from what I can tell, pols voice only appears in five rooms before 5th dungeon, so I can see how they'd overlook this. But it is still an interesting unintended quirk, due to how they handled the microphone situation.

I was under the impression that Nintendo remapped the microphone function to the 2nd controller's select button, so I thought I'd do a quick experimentation of how the 1991 Famicom cartridge release handled it and at least under an emulator the select button did not work. Nor did using arrows, which is discovered pols voice is completely immune to. (Instead of wasting time replaying the Famicom cart I used "zelda" + game genie codes for items and went strait to 2nd dungeon with the bow.)

I also discovered that with this 1991 Famicom release Nintendo attempted to simulate the missing FDS audio channel... with bad results. There's new tone added to the overworld & dungeon (and probably more) music that sounds like some hillbilly blowing into a jug. My ears are still bleeding.

Midna

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #69 on: April 06, 2016, 01:11:55 pm »
Isn't the Japanese cart version identical to the US release, sound-wise? I always thought that was the case anyway.

(Also, the Japanese cart version was released in '94, not '91.)

w1ck3d

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #70 on: April 06, 2016, 04:30:57 pm »
Yes, it's definitely using the NES audio. But, it appears some music has been changed to sound similar to the FDS tracks. Or at least it does not sound identical on my end.

KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #71 on: April 06, 2016, 04:56:39 pm »
As Pols Voice can still be defeated with the sword, I don't really see a problem with how they handled it in the NES version. It just makes a few dungeon rooms a little tougher.

And yes, the Famicom re-release didn't come out until 1994 despite its 1992 copyright on the title screen. I recall the re-release handled the Pols Voice weakness the same way as the FDS version.

I do know they rewrote the enemy description, but that may just be because there already was a hint in the game itself.

FDS Manual:
耳の大きなオバケ。大きな音に弱いという弱点を持つ。 (A ghost with big ears. It has a weakness against loud noise.)

FC Manual:
耳の大きなオバケ。見かけはかわいいが強敵だ。 (A ghost with big ears. Appears cute but it is a formidable enemy.)

Seems your ROM is a bad dump or something. In terms of audio it should be identical to the NES version.

Midna

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #72 on: April 07, 2016, 01:08:31 am »
Probably something along those lines, yeah. I especially don't think they'd add any instruments to the overworld theme since that's one of the tracks that's 1:1 identical between FDS and NES.

KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #73 on: April 07, 2016, 07:54:17 pm »
I double checked the manual for the Japanese cart, and another hint related to Pols Voice weakness was also removed. So I guess the removed hint and rewritten enemy description is no coincidence. Despite the unchanged weakness from the FDS version, it seems that Nintendo felt they had to downplay this feature with the new hardware just released.

Mari42

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #74 on: April 08, 2016, 10:51:59 am »
I'm not sure if you forget, and I know this isn't a part of a translation. But, if you go to the first dungeon then there was a locked door in the beginning. So, If you get out of the 1st dungeon and go back into dungeon, then it unlocks itself which means you don't even need a key to unlock the 1st door. I guess this one was bugged I'm sure.  :huh:

This:



to this:


KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #75 on: April 09, 2016, 05:31:27 pm »
I'm not sure if you forget, and I know this isn't a part of a translation. But, if you go to the first dungeon then there was a locked door in the beginning. So, If you get out of the 1st dungeon and go back into dungeon, then it unlocks itself which means you don't even need a key to unlock the 1st door. I guess this one was bugged I'm sure.  :huh:
No problem, have not forgotten. But I don't know if there's any cure for it. I don't know, perhaps someone with more hacking experience than me would be able to fix it. See this thread for info on some of the mechanics at work behind it: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/563433-the-legend-of-zelda/63821853

Another gameplay bug is the "Patra Glitch" The rotating pattern is sometimes disrupted on the types that rotate like a gyroscope. What happens is that some of the smaller ones break loose and begins to rotate around their own axis, when you kill some of the small ones. Don't know exactly what it is that trigger it but I have experienced it several times.

There's also a lot of minor audio and visual quirks:

* No sound effect for the cursor on the subscreen when you select the boomerang, in the rare case you're not equipped with a sword.

* The heart cursor on the file select screens share palette with the Magical Sword. This makes the hilt white if you go to the erase screen.

* Palette issue on movable block in Level-8 (2nd Quest) where a Digdogger resides. The block receive a palette change when you move it. A Digdogger and pushable block in the same room is probably the reason for it.

* The compass mark turn light green when you face a Gleeok and brown when you encounter a Dodongo or Digdogger. (the mark alternate between those colors and red) It also turns red when you face Ganon, and when you beat him the mark turns orange due to the Triforce.

* The dark color on movable blocks turns black when you push them in Level 4 (1st Quest) and Level 5 (2nd Quest). Similary, the dark grey on movable blocks turns black when you push them in Level 9 (both Quests).  But if I fix it, the palette of Zols, Gels, and Keese is affected, which makes them visible in the dark. This was a quite late change in the development as the prototype version didn't have the dark type of these enemies, hence the pushable blocks look normal in that version.

I guess most are due to memory and palette limitations. And fortunately these are extremely minor issues. Also, the "missing audio" when buying a key I pointed out earlier makes sense, keys and hearts aren't subscreen items and therefore does not have the additional item-get tune, you don't hear it when picking them up elsewhere either. So I don't know what I was thinking.  :D

w1ck3d

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #76 on: April 10, 2016, 07:02:58 am »
Can't say I've ever considered the level-1 locked door trick a 'glitch', always seemed like an easter egg for beginners. But while we're on the subject of keys, if possible, I'd like to see an infinity sign replace the 'A' that appears after collecting the magical key. Even a simple 'X' would make more sense than an 'A'.

Something like this would be a nice improvement..

Midna

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #77 on: April 10, 2016, 10:12:20 am »
The A stands for "almighty" according to the Japanese manual.

TRIFORCE89

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #78 on: April 20, 2016, 10:57:11 pm »
Also I was thinking it'd be nice to redo the staff credits, so the real names are displayed with their pseudonyms. So it'd kinda look like this after.
If interested, this is how the credits were presented in the FDS prototype version (via https://tcrf.net/Proto:The_Legend_of_Zelda#Ending):



Not sure why Ten-Ten wasn't listed here as T.Tezuka or Konchan as K.Kondo, but there it is.

KillerBob

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Re: The Legend of Zelda - relocalized (help needed)
« Reply #79 on: April 26, 2016, 06:24:25 pm »
The A stands for "almighty" according to the Japanese manual.
Yeah, it may seem silly of me but that alone is a reason for me not to alter it. But I agree, w1ck3d. An infinity symbol would make more sense.

If interested, this is how the credits were presented in the FDS prototype version...
Not sure why Ten-Ten wasn't listed here as T.Tezuka or Konchan as K.Kondo, but there it is.
Or why Tatsuo Nishiyama (if it's really him) goes by the name I.Marui. There are several reasons why developers used pseudonyms back in the NES and SNES era, I think Nintendo or at least EAD began using their real names when they began work on Super Famicom. Altering the staff roll is outside the scope of my project but as some continue to ask for it I guess I can do a separate patch. It's easily done.

It's dangerous to travel alone. Take this.

Choose, but choose wisely.

If you have the heart of a hero, I'll let you have this.

Arrows cost money. Try not to run out.

Best goods in the kingdom!

Show this to the old woman.

Buy a potion and be on your way.

Care to play a game of chance?

Walk into the waterfall.

Travel North, West, South, West, through the Lost Woods.

Use any tunnel you want.

Aim for the Gohma's eye.

Another adventure awaits our hero.
Press the start button.
Getting back to your suggestions, I really like what you did. Your line for the sword guy is quite clever. The two lines of text I wanted to change even before upload was that one, and the one for the old guy hinting at its location. The latter is very wordy in the English version and its placement in the dungeon usually means you will see the hint twice in a very short amount of time (perhaps another way of the developers to say, you better upgrade your sword). Instead of "Did you get the sword from the old man on top of the waterfall?" would "Did you get the sword from the old man above the waterfall?" work or the less specific "Did you get the sword from the old man at the waterfall?" Actually, I think it's the only one from the original that I left alone.