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Author Topic: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Version 1.21  (Read 220133 times)

IcePenguin

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #940 on: January 16, 2017, 05:03:47 pm »
Congrats on the release Grimlock and team!  Such an inspiring project!   :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

rainwarrior

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #941 on: January 16, 2017, 06:43:10 pm »
Spoiler:
I'm considering further modifying the warping area to decrease it's difficulty. ... Maybe I'll just do away with the whole thing.

In response to that, here's some detailed notes about things that I found myself stuck on during my (1.0) playthrough, and some possible suggestions regarding them:
Spoiler:
1. 10 missile doors. I know they were in the original, but in that game there was no precedent for super missile doors, power bomb doors, etc. I found these and thought there was some kind of key I needed to come back with (e.g. I wondered if the "access code" applied). I only realized what they were because I got frustrated after a couple hours of wandering around and auto-fired missiles at it in anger. A friend of mine who was playing it had the exact same problem, didn't realize he could already open them.

Obviously, getting 10 missiles is trivial, so I don't think these doors don't really add much except this potential for misunderstanding.

2. Energy refills. This is a minor thing, grinding for missiles doesn't take super long, though trying to find an appropriate infinite spawner can take some time, but it seems like you put the energy refills in to prevent that kind of empty gameplay. Why not have them refill missiles too? I was using missiles a lot until I eventually figured out how to get into the wave beam room.

3. At the beginning it took me a while to realize I could shoot the block in the aquatic area that eventually leads to the boots. Up until that point in the game, I think that's the only block you can shoot; the rest are on the floor, inaccessible until you get a bomb? That block was conspicuous, but I assumed I needed to get a bomb first and I left without getting through and did a few loops around the world before realizing. I think part of it is just that you need to stand in such a specific spot to shoot it too. This might be another way I was confused by later games' precedent where bomb-only blocks are a common thing.

I think it would help either to make that block look less like the rest of the ground (the original game had a very prominent "shootable block" tile, but MRD doesn't seem to), to invite someone to shoot it, OR place some similar looking but shootable blocks in conspicuous places the player is likely to shoot it before getting there.

4. The warping areas. I didn't mind the chozo ruins, because the warping was a very distinct feature of them. (What held me up in the ruins was the obscurity of which walls I could break to get places, not really the warping itself.) I did find it a problem in the federation ship, though. With the map showing me that the boss was just below an area I could reach, I literally spent hours going back and forth over that loop just above it bombing everything possible trying to find a hole that I missed. (At that point I was blocked on finding this boss, and the 10 missile door realization, so there was a lot of empty retreading.)

So, if I were to suggest anything there it would be to ditch the warp in the ship, or at least relocate the boss area so that it might hint the way to go to reach it, instead of being a red herring.

In the chozo ruins, the warping made sense to me, it was just how that area worked, and I kind of liked it, but the ship doing it really threw me off. (The SMB warp is completely OK, but it's not on the critical path of the game, obviously.)

I guess the rocky area with warps near the orange skeleton in the forest too is a bit odd. I don't think it held me up for a particularly long time, but when you can't figure out where to go next a place like that can easily sink a lot of time, because it's so hard to figure out if you've seen it all or not. Maybe best to confine the warping idea to just the chozo ruins entirely?

Re: escaping the ruins, if there was an elevator at the start of them, it would make save-warping to the entrance an option for people that get lost (instead of having to warp all the way back to the forest entrance).

Anyhow, I like your game a lot as it is already, so please don't interpret this as like a bad review or something, just some thoughts on parts I had a lot of trouble with.

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #942 on: January 16, 2017, 08:49:54 pm »
Thanks for the feedback and suggestions everyone, I'm currently working on an update that should address the bulk of the areas people have been having difficulty.

Please feel free to post any other suggestions (in spoiler tags), this would definitely be the time to do it.


Version 1.20 Changes in the works:  (Contains spoilers)

Spoiler:

In no particular order

1. Fix Permastuck spots discovered (5 spots have been corrected).
2. Limit warping in jungle area to Chozo ruins and redesign hive (done).
3. Open up a few locations where players were having difficulty jumping (about 4 locations fixed).
4. Make drop shafts in Metroid hive less brutal (in progress, you won't fall all the way to the bottom anymore  :thumbsup:).
5. Seal off a few passagways that may be causing people to go in circles (such as in the under water area).
6. Reduce the loop back in a couple spots in the ruins.
7. Change a few enemies from indestructible to destructible in tight areas.
8. Add wall jump marker to pause map and potentially tune it up a bit more.
9. Reduce scope of the secret area and eliminate the warping/scrolling that loops you back.
10. Correct release date in readme
11. Add Change Log to readme
12.  See if I can change the 10 missile doors to 5
13. Remove block in underwater area


Potential ASM items :

(I'll talk to Snarfblam but I'm not going to commit him to doing any changes)

1. Add missile recharge to all chargers (so missile + health)
2. Potential item collection/tracking issue (This may be fixable in Editroid during my update)



Gamerhenky

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #943 on: January 16, 2017, 10:37:46 pm »
Spoiler:
I made an ending video
WebsiteYouTube
(My RHDN Inbox almost full)

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #944 on: January 16, 2017, 10:54:50 pm »
Spoiler:
I made an ending video

If you look at about 1:55 there's a graphical artifact next to MetroidMST that's not part of the original patch.  It has to be your ROM or Emulator.

chikadubi

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #945 on: January 16, 2017, 11:26:02 pm »

Spoiler:

2. Limit warping in jungle area to Chozo ruins and redesign hive (done).
3. Open up a few locations where players were having difficulty jumping (about 4 locations fixed).
4. Make drop shafts in Metroid hive less brutal (in progress, you won't fall all the way to the bottom anymore  :thumbsup:).
5. Seal off a few passagways that may be causing people to go in circles (such as in the under water area).
6. Reduce the loop back in a couple spots in the ruins.
7. Change a few enemies from indestructible to destructible in tight areas.
9. Reduce scope of the secret area and eliminate the warping/scrolling that loops you back.
12.  See if I can change the 10 missile doors to 5
13. Remove block in underwater area


Hmm... Those changes reminds me something https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUeeFybkRxA

edit: i mean, after all patches RD will have only one straight corridor. You runs from one end to another and that's it. You beat it.  :D
« Last Edit: January 16, 2017, 11:39:20 pm by chikadubi »

MagusLOGS

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #946 on: January 16, 2017, 11:50:17 pm »
Very impressive Hack!

I am not sure if this question has been asked before but would it be possible to mark the already explored areas in a different color on the Mini Map?

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #947 on: January 17, 2017, 02:18:32 am »
Very impressive Hack!

I am not sure if this question has been asked before but would it be possible to mark the already explored areas in a different color on the Mini Map?

Snarfblam was able to pull off some really impressive ASM work on this hack but it's still based on the original M1 engine.  There's other limitations that would probably prevent that as well.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Optomon's original soundtrack is up for download

Get it here:

http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,18620.msg265987.html#msg265987
« Last Edit: January 17, 2017, 02:42:01 am by Grimlock »

LittleRollBot

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #948 on: January 17, 2017, 02:29:17 am »
Can't wait for the next patch, all of those changes sound like they are for the best. You guys are doing a tremendous job on this hack.

zuzma

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #949 on: January 17, 2017, 02:47:23 am »
Woah, wasn't even expecting any mapping changes this late. Very superb work  :thumbsup:

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #950 on: January 17, 2017, 03:25:47 am »
Love the work you guys did! Having so much fun!

Looks like someone already made a box for this. I discovered the hack here yesterday myself.
http://www.thecoverproject.net/forums/index.php?topic=21799.0

WOW, that's impressive!  Nice work!

SteveMartin

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #951 on: January 17, 2017, 03:38:55 am »
I'm kind of surprised the release of this was stumped down to a bullet point among other rom hacks on the front page and yet a translation of some D-grade Famicom game gets its own article. Thought this was something highly anticipated  :huh:

Anyway, I need to try this out sometime. Looks impressive.
Currently working on Moon: Remix RPG Adventure translation

Sikkan

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #952 on: January 17, 2017, 04:56:51 am »
Oh yes! Once I found my way though the jungle it was destined to be accomplished :D

stats: Time: 3h, 22 m and 55 secs!
Item completion 63%

I had 180 missiles, and I guess there are 255?


Awesome game guys! and this was on ver 1.0

vivify93

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #953 on: January 17, 2017, 09:01:04 am »
I'm kind of surprised the release of this was stumped down to a bullet point among other rom hacks on the front page and yet a translation of some D-grade Famicom game gets its own article. Thought this was something highly anticipated  :huh:

Anyway, I need to try this out sometime. Looks impressive.
Rogue Dawn did have a news article. http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,23418.html  :)
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madmega

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #954 on: January 17, 2017, 01:29:51 pm »
Hi, i am new here but i wanted to know if anyone has this problem with Metroid Rogue Dawn.

There are a few rooms, that when i fall down, i keep falling 2 or 3 screens and end up, a lot of rooms above the initial room.

For instance, the room where you get the boots, if i drop 2 screens, i fall, and end up very far above that room.

The same for the room in the plant level, at the far most left, you can bomb through the floor, when i do that, i fall down 3 screens, and end up in a room next through the room i felt through.

I'm thinking it might be the emulator on the NES mini that is not really understanding the rom, but i want to know if more peopl have this problem.

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #955 on: January 17, 2017, 01:55:46 pm »
Hi, i am new here but i wanted to know if anyone has this problem with Metroid Rogue Dawn.

There are a few rooms, that when i fall down, i keep falling 2 or 3 screens and end up, a lot of rooms above the initial room.

For instance, the room where you get the boots, if i drop 2 screens, i fall, and end up very far above that room.

The same for the room in the plant level, at the far most left, you can bomb through the floor, when i do that, i fall down 3 screens, and end up in a room next through the room i felt through.

I'm thinking it might be the emulator on the NES mini that is not really understanding the rom, but i want to know if more peopl have this problem.

There's warping in the level design.  I'm just about done with an update that actually removes some of the warping that was causing a lot of confusion.  For example one particular warping puzzle was designed in a way to make it very simple but when I saw a few play throughs I noticed a common trend of the players attempting to reenter from the exit side.  There was no way for them to realize that was the exit part of the puzzle without a large amount of frustrating trial and error.  Other warps are there for convenience, if you go deep into an area and locate an item or beat a boss I didn't want to make the player have to back track all the way through the entire area, so I made shortcuts.  It can be disorienting at first but most people seem to appreciate that addition to the design once they figue out what's going on.

cospefogo

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #956 on: January 17, 2017, 02:06:26 pm »
(...) I didn't want to make the player have to back track all the way through the entire area, so I made shortcuts.  It can be disorienting at first (...)

Very useful... I agree!
But I am afraid I am on the team of the disoriented guys.
I feel lost (where do I go now?) a lot of times.

Cospefogo.
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If they're a benefit, it's not my problem."

Sephirous

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #957 on: January 17, 2017, 02:27:18 pm »
I hope I didn't come across as harsh before. I think the game is pretty cool. I didn't realize alot of people were having frustration too. Makes me feel a little better, I didn't want to end up being the gloomy one out of everyone's else's joy. But now knowing frustration is a common problem, I'm glad it's being addressed.  :thumbsup:

A sequel to a prequel someday... ::)
Hacking Nes Roms Is Like Making Sweet Passionate Love, Hacking Snes Roms Is Like Having Your Bitchy Mother In Law Scream At You.

DavidtheIdeaMan

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #958 on: January 17, 2017, 03:22:56 pm »
Heh heh heh,glad to see you enjoyed it abit Seph,now you can continue on your own game! XD

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Released: 1/14/2017
« Reply #959 on: January 17, 2017, 04:09:58 pm »
Editroid Corner Map
(Navigation image from Snarfblam's Metroid editor)

This is a graphical representation of the level design, it's not highly detailed but it's interesting.  Some of the colors will differ from the in game colors due to palette swaps not represented in the preview window. 

NOTE:   All Easter eggs have been removed but the off map screens are revealed.

Click on image to show full size:

Spoiler: