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Author Topic: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" - Version 1.21  (Read 225141 times)

Raccoon Sam

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2014, 04:06:18 pm »
Looks better than any hack I've ever seen.
Stunning job!

Celice

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2014, 02:27:58 pm »
Construction of the final area Tourian has been completed  :beer: .  I'm now working on polishing up my graphics and level design for the various areas.  I spent a little time working on the Norfair area today and figured why not share a few screenshots:


This is a great sense of scale. I don't think I've seen it done so well in a 2D game, at least recently.

Gideon Zhi

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2014, 03:21:47 pm »
Pity you can't get parallax going :/

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2014, 12:14:13 am »
Thanks for the positive replys everyone!  Feedback is always appreciated  :thumbsup: .  I'm pretty happy with how things are turning out graphically and with the level design as a whole.  I'm going over and modifying my item placement as well.  I'm curious what everyone's opinion is of the higher end item placement.  Specifically the suit (armor) enhancing item, and the screw attack (damages enemies if you jump/flip into them).  Those items were fairly hidden in the original Metroid.  How difficult (in everyone's opinion) should I make these two items to find.  Right now I'm somewhat on the fence between moderately hidden or difficult to locate.  My current level design is moderately hidden.  Nether item is required to finish the game though they would make it much easier.  You have to be searching for secrets to find them (at their current locations).
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 12:42:08 am by Grimlock »

Gideon Zhi

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2014, 12:24:34 am »
Forcing the player to go out of their way for special items is a good thing, but if you ask me nothing should be just outright completely hidden: there should always be a clue of some sort pointing the player in the right direction. Whether it's something that just draws the eye and makes me think "Hmm, that block is placed a little weirdly" or a dead end path or a not-quite-obvious branch that maybe requires some bomb jumping or something. Give the player cause for pause.

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2014, 01:11:06 am »
Yea, that's pretty much been my goal with the level design and secret item placement (clues in the level design).  There's nothing as difficult as the spot you have to bomb to proceed in Norfair in the original game (just before the high jump boots).  Some of the items/pick ups are in view but you have to find another route to get to them, a few require bombing to access hidden rooms, others have entries to hidden rooms that are "hidden in plain sight", a few require the wall jump ability.  Nearly all of the items will require the player to explore and really pay attention to the environment to find.  I guess you could say it's much more like Super Metroid although it was never my intention to mimic or copy Super Metroid.  I'm pretty confident in the placement of the general items, missiles, E-tanks, and items required to beat the game.  The wave beam is placed in a secret area but it's designed so pretty much everyone should be able to locate it (the modifications to this weapon are really cool).  I'm just down to the suit item and screw attack item, I'm starting to think my current placement might work but could actually be a little more challenging for the players.

NES Boy

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2014, 01:43:02 am »
It reminds me of something I read about regarding Batman: Arkham Asylum. Apparently, Quincy Sharp's secret office containing his Arkham City plans were so well hidden that someone from the design team had to clue gamers in months after it was released.

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2014, 07:50:29 am »
It reminds me of something I read about regarding Batman: Arkham Asylum. Apparently, Quincy Sharp's secret office containing his Arkham City plans were so well hidden that someone from the design team had to clue gamers in months after it was released.

Yea, I would consider that poor level design, which I'm trying my best to avoid.  Any where you need to access (secrets) in order to progress in the game are generally only slightly hidden.  For example in one such location the breakable blocks have slight cracks in them, pretty obvious when you see it although it's also in a spot you wouldn't normally expect a secret entry so players will really have to pay attention in order to avoid going in circles.

For the most part I would say the general difficulty of this hack is equivalent to the original, some aspects are more challenging but in a good way.  Tourian (final area) in the original Metroid was pretty much a pushover so I remedied that, it's now worthy of being a final area (final boss fight is pretty intense also, as well as the escape).  The bosses were also pretty easily defeated in the original so I've designed the boss rooms to make the boss battles into something more respectable.

Gideon Zhi

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2014, 01:30:57 pm »
When designing "secrets" you shouldn't be thinking of them as secrets, but as rewards. If I have to jump through a few intellectual hoops to get a five-missile-max upgrade, then I'm going to feel just as satisfied if not moreso for figuring out the puzzle; the fact that my character is now incrementally better is the proverbial icing on the cake :)

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #29 on: November 09, 2014, 09:29:40 pm »
When designing "secrets" you shouldn't be thinking of them as secrets, but as rewards. If I have to jump through a few intellectual hoops to get a five-missile-max upgrade, then I'm going to feel just as satisfied if not moreso for figuring out the puzzle; the fact that my character is now incrementally better is the proverbial icing on the cake :)

Yea, that's a good way to look at it.  The level design is pushing player exploration so only a few item's are out there for the taking (items key to progressing).  Most require the player to observe and inspect, once discovered there's generally a challenge associated with acquiring the item (some are just there as a reward for discovering the secret room).  There aren't any blank walls or floors hiding items or entries like the original game.  Maintaining a balance of fun factor and challenge is pretty important to me in my level designs.

Trax

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2014, 10:20:16 pm »
This looks like a very ambitious project, and I lift my hat to that. One thing makes me very curious when I look at the screenshots and the maps. Will there be some kind of advanced scrolling mechanism? As far as I know, the game itself doesn't support scrolling in the 4 directions. It's either long horizontal corridors or high vertical shafts, and you usually need doors to transition between the two. The maps seem too wide for a column the width of a single screen...

NES Boy

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2014, 10:44:30 pm »
I didn't have that impression when looking at the maps. For all I knew, it's either strictly vertical or strictly horizontal, just like in the original Metroid.

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2014, 01:57:27 pm »
The hack is in the last 10% of development, depending on time availability amongst everyone involved it should be done next month.  The scrolling is vertical and horizontal, the game engine does not support multi direction scrolling.  I'm guessing it would require a complete rework of the game engine which you'll likely never see with a hack.  Something like that would be better suited to home brew I would assume, rather that gutting and replacing the way the game loads screens.

Two out of five areas don't have any bubble doors, the final area only has two.  We're using a work around to eliminate them to enhance the various environments you'll be exploring.  Also the original Metroid game alternated vertical to horizontal and vise versa, we've taken control of the scrolling which has allowed us a great deal of design freedom.

Trax

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2014, 09:57:35 pm »
Oh, okay. But aren't the maps 512 pixels wide? Does this mean you can change direction in any given screen, either vertical or horizontal?

By the way, if you need help, let me know. I'm no artist, but I'm good with ASM...

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - \"Metroid - Rogue Dawn\" Work in progress
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2014, 09:18:39 am »
Oh, okay. But aren't the maps 512 pixels wide? Does this mean you can change direction in any given screen, either vertical or horizontal?

By the way, if you need help, let me know. I'm no artist, but I'm good with ASM...

Thanks for the offer of assistance.  Snarfblam has the ASM modifications dialed in.  As far as the scrolling it can be toggled how ever we like, the only limitation is the toggling has to be triggered at the edge of a screen, not a big deal though and really I don't even know if it qualifies as a limitation, that's just how the engine works.

November 16, 2014, 10:49:25 pm - (Auto Merged - Double Posts are not allowed before 7 days.)
Metroid Rogue Dawn is now playable from start to finish!  :beer:

We're going to be moving on to beta testing pretty soon.  The first round of testing will be to balance out difficulty as well as test out some of the new features.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2014, 10:49:25 pm by Grimlock »

Trax

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #35 on: November 19, 2014, 08:10:31 pm »
Alright, count me in...

Grimlock

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2014, 08:33:22 pm »
I just updated my thread at MetroidConstruction.com so I felt it would be a goods idea to do the same here:

Update on Rogue dawn development:

We are currently working on changing the ROM mapper from MMC1 to MMC3 which will double available memory.  All previous memory limitations will be a thing of the past.  Basically that means highly detailed environments, greater memory availability for ASM code, more memory available for music creation, and much more.

With the jump from MMC1 to MMC3 the projected completion date will be pushed out to the first quarter of 2015, hopefully February but March is a possibility depending on the time required to complete the transition.  Snarfblam will also be updating Editroid to work with the new mapper so there will be some additional time requirements there.

In the mean time I'm actively working on the level design and graphics as well as planning where I want to take the level design with the freedom the memory increase will offer.  I've had to make several compromises due to the previous memory limitations so it's pretty exciting to have the opportunity to go back to the original design plan and make it happen.

Celice

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2014, 01:41:58 am »
This is really good news  :beer: It'd be neat to see some before-and-after shots, showing what the new mapper can allow for the hack :)

Jonesy47

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2014, 12:31:05 pm »
These graphics...some of the best I think I've ever seen on nes...keep up the amazing work!

Dr. Floppy

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Re: [NES] Metroid 1 hack - "Metroid - Rogue Dawn" Work in progress
« Reply #39 on: December 13, 2014, 05:35:37 am »
We are currently working on changing the ROM mapper from MMC1 to MMC3 which will double available memory.

Not MMC5? :(

j/k- Mapper conversions are fun!