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Author Topic: Translate (very) small script to japanese  (Read 20669 times)

Nagato

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2013, 08:12:14 am »
There's a typo with the saber's name. It should be either さーべる (hiragana) or サーベル (katakana), not さーべル (mixed hiragana and katakana).

I haven't played many old RPGs like this in Japanese before so I might be wrong, but shouldn't the は be up on the character's name here? "ルチアは" instead of "ルチア は".

Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2013, 09:44:00 am »
OK I took note for the Saber's name.

For the space thing, I was confused from the start. Basically Paul said not to use space, but just below, DarknessSavior told something with spaces. I therefore thought I had to use space, and that Paul just omitted them accidentally. But this was just an hypothesis.

LostTemplar

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2013, 09:53:04 am »
Japanese usually doesn't use spaces, but that's only when most of the words are written with Kanjis - they act as a visual delimiter then. However, if your text is using only Kana, it is not uncommon to put some spaces in order to help the reader. Although there are no official rules of where to put these spaces, most of the times they are inserted after finished sentence fragments. Grammatical particles are "glued" to the word they belong to - that is the one directly before them - and thus there is never a space before them.

That means that you probably should set spaces to aid the reader (though you don't have to), but if you use them, there should be none between the character's name and the は. Same goes for ファイアソード and に:

ルチアは たからばこをあけた or ルチアは たからばこを あけた
りゅうのけんは ほんらいのちからがもどり ファイアソードになった or ファイアソードに なった

(or none at all)

Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2013, 10:45:08 am »
Wow, this sure sounds complex. There is not even official rules as where to place spaces ?! What a complex language.

Anyways everything should be fine now (I also made the box smaller because not all the space was used - it will be big in the english version though).

The weapon menu :

Opening a chest :

When you get an item :

Sword that gets upgraded with fire :


STARWIN

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2013, 10:57:12 am »
I wonder if NES games have larger boxes for the english translation? If not, you have an awesome opportunity of butchering your english translation based on the japanese text box size.

LostTemplar

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2013, 10:57:44 am »
Looks fine now.

Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2013, 12:44:06 pm »
Quote
I wonder if NES games have larger boxes for the english translation? If not, you have an awesome opportunity of butchering your english translation based on the japanese text box size.
Depends on the game. Dragon Quest games had their boxes enlarged for the Dragon Warrior edition, however, Castlevania II had the same small square boxes as the japanese verison, and what you said happened.

In my game engine changing the size of the box is a matter of changing one or two lines of code. However some NES games might have more things hard-coded and it could have been hard for someone wto fix the size of the box if they are not in direct contact with the programmer (even if they have the source code).

Even though the japanese text is not much technically shorter the fact characters are packed makes it a lot less characters. Basically it's a tradeoff - you need more characters in the alphabet but then the message is shorter.

Quote
Looks fine now.
Thank you very much and thanks to everyone that helped me to do this "false japanese" version of the game. This might be a weird idea but this was very interesting and I learned some things about what makes changing the language in a game hard.

DarknessSavior

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #27 on: January 05, 2013, 02:23:53 pm »
You'd still want to make sure that saber is サーベル. The only time that Japanese games use hiragana instead of katakana for loan words is when they don't have a katakana font to begin with. You do, so you should use it.

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Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #28 on: January 05, 2013, 02:50:36 pm »
OK - I inserted the SA character and wrote it in katakana.
That makes a total of 5 katakanas in the alphabet : SA, BE, LU, CHI and A - which I know I could remove if I REALLY need them for the rest of the game (but don't plan to).

Now I have in my CHR-ROM 34 hiraganas, 3 special-mini hiraganas, 5 katakanas, and 2 dakutens, and 9 latin letters, for a great total of 53 symbols, which is "only" 27 more than the full alphabet I had before. Sounds like I could introduce lower case letters in the english version, too (this wasn't planned originally).
« Last Edit: January 05, 2013, 02:56:52 pm by Bregalad »

Garoth Moulinoski

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2013, 10:19:41 pm »
I don't know how much help this will be, but note that hiragana and katakana he are both written へ. It's a small thing to note, but might be helpful. You don't allow the player to rename characters?
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Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2013, 04:04:38 am »
Yes I of course noted this and use the same HE for both. (I noticed some games used a blod he for hiragana and a thin one for katakana, but Dragon Quest which is mostly hiragana-only uses a thin he).

I don't allow the player to rename the characters, because you know it's a simple and minimalistic game with only one hero. Like in Mega Man you have to play Mega Man and can't rename him, or in Zelda you have to play as Link and can't rename him, in Castlevania you have to play as Simon and can't rename him, etc....

Paul Jensen

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #31 on: January 07, 2013, 04:44:52 am »
Japanese usually doesn't use spaces, but that's only when most of the words are written with Kanjis - they act as a visual delimiter then. However, if your text is using only Kana, it is not uncommon to put some spaces in order to help the reader. Although there are no official rules of where to put these spaces, most of the times they are inserted after finished sentence fragments. Grammatical particles are "glued" to the word they belong to - that is the one directly before them - and thus there is never a space before them.

That means that you probably should set spaces to aid the reader (though you don't have to), but if you use them, there should be none between the character's name and the は. Same goes for ファイアソード and に:

ルチアは たからばこをあけた or ルチアは たからばこを あけた
りゅうのけんは ほんらいのちからがもどり ファイアソードになった or ファイアソードに なった

(or none at all)

This.

HTH
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Midna

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2013, 04:16:05 pm »
Just want to say that, while ルチア is an acceptable translation for "Lucia", I probably would have gone with ルシア, which is closer to how the name is pronounced in English.

Garoth Moulinoski

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #33 on: January 07, 2013, 04:23:32 pm »
That's true. チ is a hard "ch" sound. Luchia. シ is softer, closer to the "see" sound heard in Lucia (Loo-SEE-AH).

Do not trust machine translators. They try their best but they fail more often than not it comes to things like these, i.e. because Lucia contains a "c" instead of an "s", a machine would more than gladly put a "チ" in there because the common romanization is "chi" despite the name calling for an "s"-er sound, like シ (shi, pronounced like English she as in "She sells seashells").
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Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #34 on: January 07, 2013, 06:03:48 pm »
Lucia is an italian name originally, and whille in french I'd be tempted to pronunce the "c" as a "s" ( /lysja/), in italian the C letter is pronounced something like "tch". I actually hesitated between the shi and the chi since I don't know how they are pronunced in japanese... I really don't know what to do with this one.

Also, I remember when I chose this name, I think I was 15 year old so this was 8 years ago before I even started to work on the game I had to design it. I thought most games only have boys as heroes and that this was boring so I would have a girl instead. And it really came as if it was a "revelation" this was the name I had to give to my heroine. I miss the old times when I had things popping in my head as soon as I needed them. Now that I'm a fully grown guy I have nowhere the imagination I used to have as a teenager. Oh well...
« Last Edit: June 28, 2013, 12:16:01 pm by Bregalad »

Garoth Moulinoski

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2013, 07:48:36 pm »
I miss the old times when I had things popping in my head as soon as I needed them. Now that I'm a fully grown guy I have nowhere the imagination I used to have as a teenager. Oh well...

I'm going through this right now and it's very frustrating. It's worse when you've got a combination of a sister who's much more artistically talented than you telling you your ideas suck (although recently I've realized we have different tastes regardless) and having a background where I'm torn between using "easy" tools and established "reputable" programming languages. It sucks. Good luck with this project.

(And if your aim is to have the hard "tch" sound, than keep the katakana [ルチア] as is. It's fine as it is now that you've told us that.)
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Bregalad

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2013, 08:04:26 am »
I hadn't planned this originally, but after all since this thread is still alive, why not...

Could someone tell me how you could put the title of the game, Dragon Skill, in kanjis, for the title screen ?
I know there is probably 189 different kanjis for Dragon but just the standard one which reads Ryu (in order to be compatible with the sword's name) will do fine.

Garoth Moulinoski

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #37 on: January 08, 2013, 08:56:29 am »
竜特技 (りゅうとくぎ)(lit. Dragon Special Skill)
竜実技 (りゅうじつぎ)(lit. Dragon Practical Skill)
竜腕前 (りゅううでまえ)(lit. Dragon Ability
竜手際 (りゅうてぎわ)(lit. Dragon Skill)
ドラゴンスキル (Dragon Skill)
竜スキル (りゅうスキル)(lit. Dragon Skill

Jisho on "skill" (common words filter)

Honestly, the best one would probably end up being ドラゴンスキル. The rest are just kinda funky. Although 竜特技 could still work. Or 竜手際 since there's kinda a play there with the kanji for hand being used and 際 can mean adventurous. 竜スキル is probably the worst, after 竜実技. :P

Edit: Fixed スキール to スキル
« Last Edit: January 08, 2013, 09:32:12 am by Garoth Moulinoski »
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LostTemplar

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #38 on: January 08, 2013, 09:22:20 am »
Just 竜技(りゅうぎ) would do. There's also the character 龍 you can substitute for 竜, they mean exactly the same and have the same readings.

By the way, "skill" is スキル in Japanese, no elongation.

Garoth Moulinoski

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Re: Translate (very) small script to japanese
« Reply #39 on: January 08, 2013, 09:34:23 am »
I even seen it without elongation but I added it anyway because my brain is dumb. :/ It doesn't even only happen with スキル. I tend to elongate other words too just because (like an involuntary action). I really have to stop that habit. Thank you, LostTemplar!
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