Romhacking.net

Romhacking => Script Help and Language Discussion => Topic started by: DarknessSavior on December 11, 2012, 05:14:52 pm

Title: シュビッ?
Post by: DarknessSavior on December 11, 2012, 05:14:52 pm
シュビッ seems to be an onomatopoeia of some kind. I see it used all over the place when I google it, but nowhere has any sort of definition or usage of it.

Can someone shed the light on this one?

~DS
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Nagato on December 11, 2012, 05:41:06 pm
I've always been bad at onomatopoeia but I'm a curious person. From all of the usages I could find, it seems to be the onomatopoeia for when a hand is raised. It might cover more than just hands but those are the only usages I could find.

Some examples I found:
シュビッと手を挙げていただければスタッフが駆けつけます。
アンコがシュビッ!と手を翳した。
“要る人ー”に反応して、シュビッと手を上げる。
シュビッと親指を二本上げる
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 11, 2012, 06:20:52 pm
Most instances I can see involve basically snapping into a gesture (e.g. pointing, thumbs-up) such that it makes a whoosh/swipe sound. It is occasionally paired up with しゃっ, a more conventional swoosh type sound.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: granz on December 11, 2012, 06:38:20 pm
This (http://xspblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/Konachan.com-23992-2x2shinobuden-ninin_ga_shinobuden-ninja-salute-shinobu-vector.jpg) comes to mind. Characters often give salutes or various similar gestures in animated media. Maybe it would make sense to have some sort of onomatopoeia to represent it. I guess I could see it appearing in a video game in which character sprites can't necessarily be animated performing this gesture, but the writers otherwise need to indicate that it's happening?

I don't know how (nor if) I'd translate something like that in a video game, film or TV series, aside from narrating it verbosely.

"Keiko-chan salutes!" (I'm sure you could come up with something better though)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 11, 2012, 06:53:46 pm
Oftentimes the only correct way to translate Japanese onomatopoeia is to raise your right arm, place your left hand on the scriptures, and give yourself several open-hand smacks to the face until you remember that it’s better left out.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: granz on December 12, 2012, 01:32:40 am
Then you have all those people who feel like they've been cheated because you didn't include onomatopoeia, honorifics, etc. in your translation; and some people just can't accept that there are sometimes incommunicable differences between one language and another. I'm probably close to opening a can of worms, though.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: jka12002 on December 12, 2012, 01:36:10 am
I've always been bad at onomatopoeia but I'm a curious person. From all of the usages I could find, it seems to be the onomatopoeia for when a hand is raised. It might cover more than just hands but those are the only usages I could find.

Some examples I found:
シュビッと手を挙げていただければスタッフが駆けつけます。
アンコがシュビッ!と手を翳した。
“要る人ー”に反応して、シュビッと手を上げる。
シュビッと親指を二本上げる

Just for the hell of it i translated that....

You mentioned シュビッ and hand the staff rushes.
Anko is the シュビッ! And 翳した hands.
"People need-" in response, raising hands with シュビッ.
Two thumbs up and シュビッ up
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 12, 2012, 01:47:55 am
( ゚ -゚) That’s not a translation.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: jka12002 on December 12, 2012, 01:55:20 am
( ゚ -゚) That’s not a translation.

I used babel fish translator so go figure  ::)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 12, 2012, 03:54:58 am
That's shocking, even for google  :huh:
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 12, 2012, 04:31:27 am
That’s not Google, either.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 12, 2012, 05:11:32 am
You mean there is more than one? How many different sites does it take to fuck up a language?
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 12, 2012, 10:54:22 am
You mean there is more than one? How many different sites does it take to fuck up a language?

Far too many.


Couldn't you translate シュビッ as a small "whoosh". Or, "in a quick gesture" if it's something like a novel. Or, what BRP said: Leave it out.

Then you have all those people who feel like they've been cheated because you didn't include onomatopoeia, honorifics, etc. in your translation; and some people just can't accept that there are sometimes incommunicable differences between one language and another. I'm probably close to opening a can of worms, though.

They should just learn the language and read/listen what they want to in Japanese and they'll have their onomatopoeia, honorifics, and etc.

A lot of stuff is translatable. Just that one language may have a word for an idea when another language may need a sentence for it. And, well, you shouldn't translate most names (but if the change makes sense).

Edit: I should've added this earlier: A lot of people seem to hold certain languages that they don't fully know as this mystic thing that has a near ritual for every word, sentence, everything. I'm reading Shogun right now, and the author shoe-horned a lot of strangely written Japanese (some strange kind of romaji that isn't standard or even consistent). The guy does include honorifics, but that was for cultural reasons. The book is about culture shock between an English sailor and Japanese. It's not bad, but it really treats Japanese as being really far out people whose culture is shocking and terrifying (when it isn't being awed by it). It borderlines on almost childish awe than respect. But this mini rant is neither here or there in this thread. Just had to get that off my chest.

...If you got close to opening a can of worms, I think I started prying open the lid. But I really wanted to point the translatable thing out.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: LostTemplar on December 12, 2012, 11:22:36 am
They should just learn the language and read/listen what they want to in Japanese and they'll have their onomatopoeia, honorifics, and etc.

So many times this.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 12, 2012, 04:22:24 pm
You mean there is more than one? How many different sites does it take to fuck up a language?
         C∧ ∧
   ___    ○(゚Д゚;)
 /◎\……C|  \
          ∧
/ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄  ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄
| It carries out and is w
\___________________

Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 12, 2012, 04:39:28 pm
         C∧ ∧
   ___    ○(゚Д゚;)
 /◎\……C|  \
          ∧
/ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄  ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄
| It carries out and is w
\___________________



It's throwing... peanuts? At a target...? And... it... ヽ(ー_ー )ノ マイッタ
I'll go away now before someone advises me to.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 12, 2012, 06:14:50 pm
       ∧ ∧  / ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄
       ∩゚Д゚)< Who gave you my number!?
□………(つ  |   \________________
 ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄|
.  Help Line    |
.             |
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: granz on December 12, 2012, 07:17:33 pm
       ∧ ∧  / ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄
       ∩゚Д゚)< You gave me gonorrhea!?
□………(つ  |   \________________
 ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄|
.    Free Clinic     |
.             |
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 12, 2012, 08:45:28 pm
So many times this.

This many more times.

One thing I can't fucking stand is people who cannot speak Japanese complaining about someone else translations. It just makes my blood boil.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: jka12002 on December 12, 2012, 10:27:25 pm
This many more times.

One thing I can't fucking stand is people who cannot speak Japanese complaining about someone else translations. It just makes my blood boil.

Like i said i just did it for the hell of it because i was wondering what it said myself. I dont see what the big deal is anyway. If i offended anyone then i do apologize, it wasnt my intention.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: granz on December 12, 2012, 11:06:35 pm
Like i said i just did it for the hell of it because i was wondering what it said myself. I dont see what the big deal is anyway. If i offended anyone then i do apologize, it wasnt my intention.

I don't think anyone was addressing you with those comments. It was just a general sentiment toward people who complain about fan translations not being 100% inclusive or literally accurate, even though the people complaining don't understand Japanese themselves.

No worries :)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 12, 2012, 11:07:24 pm
Like i said i just did it for the hell of it because i was wondering what it said myself. I dont see what the big deal is anyway. If i offended anyone then i do apologize, it wasnt my intention.

What? No. We're complaining about something completely different now. People piss and moan like cats sleep and eat around here, gotta keep on top of all the first-world-problems if you want to stay alive kiddo.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Ryusui on December 13, 2012, 07:14:54 am
I don't think anyone was addressing you with those comments. It was just a general sentiment toward people who complain about fan translations not being 100% inclusive or literally accurate, even though the people complaining don't understand Japanese themselves.

Here's a worst-case scenario for you: people who not only don't understand Japanese, but base their attitudes about translations - official and otherwise - on other people's translations which are wrong.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 13, 2012, 07:41:27 am
Here's a worst-case scenario for you: people who not only don't understand Japanese, but base their attitudes about translations - official and otherwise - on other people's translations which are wrong.

I've never had that before. Does it not make you just want to up and quit?
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 13, 2012, 08:15:53 am
I've never had that before. Does it not make you just want to up and quit?

Why take the easy way out?
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Paul Jensen on December 13, 2012, 09:09:16 am
I should've added this earlier: A lot of people seem to hold certain languages that they don't fully know as this mystic thing that has a near ritual for every word, sentence, everything.

A thousand times this. I think anyone who's learned Japanese has been guilty of this at some point or another, though.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 13, 2012, 09:16:19 am
Why take the easy way out?

Why bother doing unpaid translations for ungrateful patrons?
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 13, 2012, 09:16:27 am
A thousand times this. I think anyone who's learned Japanese has been guilty of this at some point or another, though.

Probably. I won't deny that some words sound much cooler in Japanese (to a person who's native language isn't Japanese). But c'mon. If you're writing a translation, translate it, don't keep it there and then add a subnote saying "Keikaku = Plan". Puh-lease.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Eien Ni Hen on December 13, 2012, 10:00:05 pm
Why bother doing unpaid translations for ungrateful patrons?

Most depressing thing I've read all day.  :(
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 13, 2012, 10:50:30 pm
Most depressing thing I've read all day.  :(

?
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Eien Ni Hen on December 13, 2012, 11:19:40 pm
?

I interpreted your comment as: "Fans suck. Why bother doing something for fun? Just get that money." Probably not how you intended it, but damn if it didn't depress me. I've been doing fan translation as a hobby for a long time, and if I were only in it for the fans/appreciation/notoriety I would've stopped long before now.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 13, 2012, 11:40:31 pm
I interpreted your comment as: "Fans suck. Why bother doing something for fun? Just get that money." Probably not how you intended it, but damn if it didn't depress me. I've been doing fan translation as a hobby for a long time, and if I were only in it for the fans/appreciation/notoriety I would've stopped long before now.

Exactly. Most of the translators on this board do translations primarily for themselves and their friends, yet are nice enough to release their translations to the public. When I meant was simply not releasing translations to the constantly-complaining-yet-somehow-feel-entitled masses. Let them play the game in Japanese if they feel they are proficient enough in the language to take pot-shots at someone else's translation. It's like complaining about the free samples you get at the supermarket.

I translate professionally and have never been subjected to the level of rudeness, ungratefulness and all-round bullshit that a lot of fan translators put up with.

It's not just games and rom-hacks either. I remember browsing some anime related boards a while ago and people were  complaining about (what they perceived to be) mistranslations in the fan-sub. So they were complaining about an anime series they didn't pay for, which was subbed by someone for free so they could enjoy it in the first place. It makes me rage so hard that I can't stand to read anime forums anymore.

Anyway sorry for bringing you down. This should cheer you up. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tksjPfzRND8)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Eien Ni Hen on December 14, 2012, 12:10:32 am
Exactly. Most of the translators on this board do translations primarily for themselves and their friends, yet are nice enough to release their translations to the public. When I meant was simply not releasing translations to the constantly-complaining-yet-somehow-feel-entitled masses. Let them play the game in Japanese if they feel they are proficient enough in the language to take pot-shots at someone else's translation. It's like complaining about the free samples you get at the supermarket.

I translate professionally and have never been subjected to the level of rudeness, ungratefulness and all-round bullshit that a lot of fan translators put up with.

It's not just games and rom-hacks either. I remember browsing some anime related boards a while ago and people were  complaining about (what they perceived to be) mistranslations in the fan-sub. So they were complaining about an anime series they didn't pay for, which was subbed by someone for free so they could enjoy it in the first place. It makes me rage so hard that I can't stand to read anime forums anymore.

Anyway sorry for bringing you down. This should cheer you up. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tksjPfzRND8)

Ah, that makes more sense. You meant it in a "I can't believe you put up with this." way, rather than a "Why are you doing this for free, sucker?" way. That (and the crazy video) make me feel better.  :D

I've never done fansub work (partly for the reason you describe), but the closest thing I've gotten to complaints are that I'm not working fast enough (manga translations). To those people I say TS. :P
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: jka12002 on December 14, 2012, 02:31:51 pm
Professonal translators make this mistake too you know. Remember Super Street Fighter 2, cammy's ending?

Japan version - She was actually a body created by Shadaloo for Bison to transfer himself into.
USA version - Bison and Cammy were former lovers.  ::)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 14, 2012, 04:38:06 pm
Japan version - She was actually a body created by Shadaloo for Bison to transfer himself into.
USA version - Bison and Cammy were former lovers.  ::)

Actually... I doubt that was an accident. Given what you just revealed, there was probably a moral issue here, what with a guy transferring himself to a woman's body. In the localizers' minds, they probably felt that wouldn't go over too well with the Moral Guardians, at least not in the USA. (Obviously an irony, and hypocrisy, considering how USA is the land of the free and home of the brave, but whatever)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: LostTemplar on December 14, 2012, 04:52:24 pm
That's not even completely true, Japanese SSF2's ending only stated that she was a spy working for Shadaloo who lost her memory. Though the translation still is pretty... off; I wonder why they changed this, it isn't nearly as controversial as the cloning one (which actually was in the English version of SFA3, as far as I can tell), and it makes no fucking sense, to boot.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 14, 2012, 06:26:07 pm
Professonal translators make this mistake too you know. Remember Super Street Fighter 2, cammy's ending?
1) Most likely not professional translators in any sense besides doing it for pay.
2) Most likely not a mistake; Capcom changed all sorts of things due to hasty marketing-type decisions back in the day. It’s the same sort of thinking that brought us Bad Box Art Mega Man from a time when Japanese video game companies in the U.S. tended to be little more than a marketing sub-department with a company name.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: KingMike on December 14, 2012, 07:49:50 pm
I'll also agree that first ending sounds really creepy and possibly controversial. I'd be surprised if NoA wouldn't have censored it.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 14, 2012, 08:27:01 pm
Lost is correct. The Japanese SSF2 ending is actually less spicy.

Of course, another reason the official SF2 translations don’t read very well is that they decided to stick with space limitations.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: jka12002 on December 14, 2012, 08:39:35 pm
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_manhuhkyFY1qd0dseo1_500.png)
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Ryusui on December 14, 2012, 09:01:49 pm
I've never had that before. Does it not make you just want to up and quit?

It's made me want to facewall and eroded my faith in humanity. But I did win in the end.

Edo's Yu-Gi-Oh! Page is no longer misleading the fanbase with its incessant stupidity. And I've become something of a minor translation authority on the Yu-Gi-Oh! Wikia. (http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Ryusui) :3
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 14, 2012, 09:42:39 pm
It's made me want to facewall and eroded my faith in humanity. But I did win in the end.

Edo's Yu-Gi-Oh! Page is no longer misleading the fanbase with its incessant stupidity. And I've become something of a minor translation authority on the Yu-Gi-Oh! Wikia. (http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Ryusui) :3

I'll keep that in mind. I sometimes get commissioned to write definitions of Japanese words in English for online dictionary sites (if someone searches for a word and there is no definition in the database then the searched word get put into a list and then that list gets sent to me to translate). Yugio card titles are surprisingly common. I normally have to take guesses as to what the card name in English might be and then search it in google to find the official translation, if there is one.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: BRPXQZME on December 14, 2012, 11:01:54 pm
I'll keep that in mind. I sometimes get commissioned to write definitions of Japanese words in English for online dictionary sites (if someone searches for a word and there is no definition in the database then the searched word get put into a list and then that list gets sent to me to translate). Yugio card titles are surprisingly common. I normally have to take guesses as to what the card name in English might be and then search it in google to find the official translation, if there is one.
time to send more work your way, then, I guess ;P
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Myria on December 19, 2012, 07:27:19 pm
This many more times.

One thing I can't fucking stand is people who cannot speak Japanese complaining about someone else translations. It just makes my blood boil.
I complain about Ted Woolsey's translations, and I can't read Japanese.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 19, 2012, 07:56:01 pm
I complain about Ted Woolsey's translations, and I can't read Japanese.

Go do a head stand into a lawnmower
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Myria on December 20, 2012, 01:03:45 am
Go do a head stand into a lawnmower

My point was that I don't think your hard line on criticism is entirely valid.  I can't read Japanese, but I know the alphabet, so I can complain about Woolsey renaming ティーナ to Terra and ミリア to Tyr (in two different games).
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: geishaboy on December 20, 2012, 01:29:44 am
My point was that I don't think your hard line on criticism is entirely valid.  I can't read Japanese, but I know the alphabet, so I can complain about Woolsey renaming ティーナ to Terra and ミリア to Tyr (in two different games).

Well, complaining about the quality of something you actually paid for is a lot different and I can't really take away your right to moan about something you precieve to be stuff-up, but just remember that despite all that, Ted Woolsey is still infinitely better at Japanese than you are. So while you have the right to voice your opinions, complaining about his translations is a bit like a person with no taste buds complaining about the steak dinner you just ordered. No one is saying you can't do it, you just look like a complete asshole when you do.
Title: Re: シュビッ?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on December 20, 2012, 08:22:23 am
My point was that I don't think your hard line on criticism is entirely valid.  I can't read Japanese, but I know the alphabet, so I can complain about Woolsey renaming ティーナ to Terra and ミリア to Tyr (in two different games).

He had reasons to change Tina to Terra (I don't know anything about Miria to Tyr, I don't even recognize the reference). Supposedly, to the Japanese audience, Tina is an exotic name. In the US and Europe? It's not an entirely uncommon name. Terra sounds more exotic to English-hearing ears (or English-reading eyes). I won't claim that it's entirely great to be changing names around, but at least this example wasn't done on a whim. Check out Tomato's justification for changing Yokuba's name to Fassad (it had to do with puns).